I'm aware, but it's still a very attractive line even without the Azusa you can tap, sac, play, sac the cradle getting two cradle activations in a turn.

Yay even wothout Azuse would be neat to tap Cradle twice per turn

Something that just occurred to me; Often you will get Sylvan Safekeeper in response to targeted removal which locks you out from getting Quirion Ranger and forcing you to go for something like V2 Scryb Ranger, V3 Azusa, Lost but Seeking but that line doesn't really hold up under a slew of targeted removal since you aren't guaranteed to have lands in hand to keep the Sylvan Safekeeper active. However, now we have the ability to V1 Sylvan Safekeeper, V2 Scryb Ranger, V3 Magus of the Crucible. This allows us to do silly things with Gaea's Cradle and Strip Mine effects but it also lets us sustain Sylvan Safekeeper activations over the midgame and worry less about stretching our land situation too thin by sacrificing too much land over the long game.

Ironically it also lets us effectively untap 2 lands under a Winter Orb and an additional permanent under Static Orb.

Also, playstyle question: What line do you find yourself going for most commonly?

My meta is basically archenemy, where i get focused every game so I basically got safekeeper into scryb ranger into Azusa to protect myself. Then I usually hit thought knot targeting biggest threat slash most likely to have board wipe in Hand.

@ShaperSavant Have you had any chance to proxy up excavator and test it out yet? I've slotted it in in my build over Carpet of Flowers just because there's not always a deck in my meta every week and it's fantastic if I have to take the Safekeeper line on V1.

Turns out, V1 safekeeper, sac land for shroud, V2 Scryb ranger, V3 excavator is actually quite nice even if I don't hit a strip mine or cradle.

Love the list. You have the best Yisan list.Cards for the deck I'd like to hear your take on:Ramunap Excavator (with Strip/Safekeeper/Azusa/Cradle)Scavenger Grounds (Excellent graveyard hate IMO)Deserted Temple (Untap Cradle)Yavimaya Hollow (Protection)Loaming Shaman (Grave hate and loops)Ulvenwald Hydra (Tutor Cradle)Eldritch Evolution (Creature tutor)Hour of Promise (Tutor Cradle and Temple or Dryad Arbor)Hope Tender (Untap Cradle and Temple)Elvish Pioneer (Turn 2 Yisan and loop with Quirion)Duplicant (Iona, general protection/control)

Hello Bonestink, I've been playing Yisan for almost 3 years now. Here is my take on your comment:

• Ramunap Excatavor is a bit slow for Yisan. We have better verse 3 options.
• Scavenger Grounds is an excellent inclusion in Yisan. I just added it into my list the other day.
• Deserted Temple/Yaviamya Hollow have had their moments (at least in my deck). However, you need a high forest count due to interactions with Quirion and Scyrb Ranger. These two lands can be scrapped.
• Loaming Shaman has more utility than Ramunap Excavator, but is also slow and gimicky. It is fun to Verse for Loaming Shaman after someone Vamp Tutors though.
• I've always been against Ulvenwald Hydra because it's expensive and slow. However I recently added Natural Order which could make it more viable.
• Eldritch Evolution is a great card in many decks, but I've found it to be underwhelming in Yisan. Natural Order is just so much better in here.
• Hour of Promise is way to expensive and slow for this deck. I would take Ulvenwald Hydra over this 100% of the time because we can tutor for Hydra.
• Hope tender had potential if it was an elf (It would combo with Cradle + Wirewood Lodge). You are better off with Magus of the Candelabra if this is what you are going for. I run Voyaging Satyr in my deck.
• Elvish Pioneer is a dead card if you don't have lands in your hand. It does synergize with Q ranger, however both of these cards are verse 1's :(.
• Duplicant is a great card, but is meta dependent. I run it because Linvala gets a lot of play in my group. However, if you are playing against combo/storm decks, you'd rather have more interaction.

I feel like you're underestimating Ramunap Excavator RedReveng3

We may have faster lines but in metas with more removal we have to take the Sylvan Safekeeper line more often than not. This means we can't take our faster lines. If we have Excavator we aren't reliant on topdecking lands to compensate for those sacced by Safekeeper.

Additionally, if we have a natural Cradle Excavator enables more ramp than any other 3 drop we have when we can sac it and replay it. (Not to mention if we are able to generate 6 mana and activate twice getting Excavator and Azusa together. 4 Cradle activations in a turn)

Ohthenoises I agree with RedReveng3 on most counts here. I think Excavator will be a niche pickup if you find yourself always going for Safekeeper, but it's not an effect I want to see every game, especially as it's difficult to ensure there are fetches or strips in the graveyard, and I'll probably almost never tutor them over Cradle.

The Cradle lines are quite cute, but that line doesn't find the untapper to double-3 or the Cradle itself so it seems very Christmas-land to me.

Actually if you V1 Safekeeper and V2 Scryb Ranger then V3 excavator I have found that 2 cradle activations in a turn is more than sufficient to cast anything you want and put you miles ahead of anyone. (Also I'd never want to tutor for fetches over Cradle either, Cradle has more synergy with Excavator anyways since people will frequently Strip Mine Cradle.)

What I'm saying is that it's still good without the double activation christmasland, I play in a fairly removal dense meta and I was constantly forced to take the V1 Safekeeper line, and while Azusa helped in that regard she didn't help when it came to replacing the lands from Sylvan Safekeeper's protection if I had no lands in hand to feed into the engine. The ability to sustain the Shroud protection over a longer period has already won me multiple games against Zur, Karador, and Teferi-walker and I plan on getting more data ASAP. When I mentioned the double activation line I was just pointing out that it has the potential to provide more mana than some of the other 3 drops given the right situation. (Just like Karametra's Acolyte needing the right situation, or Azusa needing the right situation.)

I'm not just theorycrafting here, and it's not just an "it's good on paper" thing. I'd encourage you to at least try it in a few games, I've been putting as many games as I can and intentionally going for the safekeeper line just to test it's speed against many Tier 1 decks.

You've brought up some good points. I'll playtest Excavator :).

I do believe it is very meta dependent though. If you go V1 safekeeper, Excavator can be a strong V3 choice. I'm just skeptical of how useful the card will be if we don't get safekeeper on the field. I doubt I'd ever V3 for Excavator over some of our other options.

Excavator does synergize with the new Scavenging Grounds, Strip Mine, Fetches, Mouth of Ronom, and Sylvan Safekeeper. You could even run Wasteland to make this card more viable. This could be enough targets to make Excavator a valuable target.

While the rest is true, Scavenger Grounds will most likely exile itself after the first use, so there is no real synergy with that one.

Good catch Emzed!

re: "I doubt I'd ever V3 for Excavator over some of our other options." I mean how often do we go and get Wirewood Symbiote over Quirion Ranger? In most of my games never, having to bounce an elf set me back more than bouncing a land for sure.

It's in there for the alternative line or if you have to rebuild after a wipe and go back up the chain in my experience.

You'd never want to grab Wirewood Symbiote early on. This is because of the reason you stated. In this deck, Symbiote is a combo piece that also enables. He can also play the midrange game. We will grab this card using a tutor or through Woodland Bell.

Excavator isn't a combo enabler and in most cases he's a mid range piece that allows us to get more value out of other cards (Fetches, Strip Mines/Wastelands, Mouth of Ronom). This is why I'm going to test him in my deck. My meta is heavy stax. So grindy cards like Excavator are very valuable. If you are playing against fast decks, you'd rather have Natural State, or Unravel the Aether over this card.

Simply using wirewood as an example is all.

Has anyone tried to use Magus of the Candelabra? It seems like another infinite mana outlet with the untap artifacts and a big mana land.

dmorales I'd probably use Voyaging Satyr first; he's a better general dork and lets you go Quirion first.

Scavenger Grounds has been huge! What do you think about adding Endless Sands as a way to protect things from spot removal or sweepers, or just as a utility to reuse ETB, while also being another Desert? I've also found Lodestone Golem to be an awesome disruptive 4-drop, where there was not much utility included on 4 in your list.

ShaperSavant Have you considered Vines of Vastwood?

Also, just wanted to point out if you are looping Thought-Knot Seer infinitely, that is a kill right there - the draw is not a may. Beast Within all mana sources and then force opponents to draw their entire deck one card at a time. If they get Force of Will and a blue card somehow, you can just rebuy it with E Wit.

Looping TKS indefinitely isn't easy, since you need coolorless mana to cast it. The current build could only do that with the help of a non-summoning sick Boreal Druid or by looping Sol Ring or Mana Crypt via Beast Within + Eternal Witness. Usually, setting that up requires drawing the deck, at which point this kind of kill isn't even necessary any more. Just kill all their permanents with Beast Within and Somberwald Stag, drop a couple of spheres (Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst) and kill them with Craterhoof Behemoth or Great Oak Guardian (can easily wait until next turn if you lack attackers at that point).
So killing them with TKS is fine, but very rarely is an actual upgrade over what the deck already has. The card should be played for its disruptive power, and being a potential win condition should not factor into this.

@Bonestink,

Scavenger Grounds is great in Yisan. I'd take it over Cavern in most cases. Endless Sands is a bit cute. 6 mana and lose a land is a bit cute to protect a single creature. If you want to add another desert, consider adding Hashep Oasis (Taps for Colorless for Warping Wail & Thought-Knot Seer, taps for Green, and counts as a Desert). However, being a desert only matters if we have Scavenger Grounds already on the field (highly unlikely).

Verse 4 is critical in Yisan decks. Remember we need Temur Sabertooth to combo off. Sabertooth also provides protection and gives us an engines with ETB abilities. 9/10 games you will grab Sabertooth. You grab Acolyte if you need a big mana dork, or grab Seer if you fear an Ad Naus/Wrath. Basically, if we add additional CMC 4 creatures, they need to have a huge impact for them to be played over these three creatures.

@AragornS,

These instant speed protection spells are generally weak, but they can be useful against removal heavy metas. Consider Autumn's Veil?

RedReveng3 I'd rather have Cavern because good blue players will attempt to counter Yisan every chance they get

If your opponents are willing to burn a counter spell on Yisan early in the game, then chances are you are playing against decks that are far weaker than yours (No Storm decks, Hermit Druid decks, etc). Removal is a much strong option against Yisan.

On another note, on average you will cast Yisan turn 2. These mono-blue players will have to be going ahead of you and must keep mana open to successfully counter him (very unlikely).

Over the last ~3 years playing him, Cavern has only helped me twice.