RIP USA
The Blind Eternities forum
Posted on Nov. 9, 2016, 11:54 a.m. by greyninja
It makes me gag to say his name; but Donald Trump has won the presidential race. NOT by popular vote, but by electoral votes. THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING. We are not being accurately represented and we will pay the consiquences.
I would like all of our foreign mtg friends to know that the majority of the country did not vote for this man. Many of us are scared of what the future will bring.
Feel free to discuss
EndStepTop says... #3
Can double sleeving protect my cards from a nuclear winter?
November 9, 2016 12:05 p.m.
EndStepTop So long as you protect the cards from the actual blast, they shouldn't be very damaged. You'd have to wear a lead suit whenever you played a game of Magic, but the upside is that your opponents should feel unwell and be taken to hospital before you lose a full match.
November 9, 2016 12:23 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #5
Instead of more division-based politics, why don't we try some unity and cooperation?
And I've always found the "we didn't vote for this person" argument asinine; the design of our political system is such that our elected officials represent us regardless of our individual preferences. Besides, we have a comparatively poor voter turnout to begin with, so the popular vote is not a truly accurate representation of what "the people" want.
November 9, 2016 12:25 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #6
To caveat what Epoch said, whether or not you support neither of the candidates one thing is crystal clear. The game has changed. We are all in this together and the oldest and richest man had the same amount of leverage as the poorest... one vote. Nobody has a label. Nobody is black, white, gay, straight, trans, hispanic, or whatever... we are Americans.
What happened last night was historic. Think about it... the GOP literally snatched the "blue collar vote" right out from under the Dems (which is arguably very weird) and like it or not, Trump has proven that you dont have to be a politician to win an election. If anything, YOU, my friend can run for an office of your choosing and actually have a chance! Thats an amazing feeling. To know that the system in place is not exclusive. That it is not "rigged". It slams the conspiracy theorists and the career politicians and Wall Street (which is why the Market took a panicked shit last night, but is currently recovering).
I am not saying that he is the best person for the job. I am saying that for the next year, he needs to be very VERY careful about how he conducts himself. The world is watching. And I could say anything to him right now, it would be this: "Dude, I dont like you. But you are it. You have the free world in the palm of your orange hands... do not fuck this up. We are trusting you with our future."
November 9, 2016 12:40 p.m.
While I profoundly question the decision-making of the american voting population, I am not unwilling to remain open-minded.
November 9, 2016 1:03 p.m.
I mean I'm not happy about trump being president but he's better than a proven liar, traitor, and child trafficker. Regardless, DNC kind of screwed themselves over; by guaranteeing Bernie didn't win, they took away any possibility of a Democratic president.
November 9, 2016 1:59 p.m.
@ Epochalyptik has a point. One of the major things this question was founded on was unity. Hell, George Washington even stated that the country needs to avoid political parties to continue to be unified. Maybe this is the begining of that breakup....
November 9, 2016 4:13 p.m.
There definitely shouldn't be political parties, just candidates with their own views and goals; people ascribing to one party just makes the actual matters less important in decision making. As Duverger's Law states, though, we'll always have two political parties and nothing will really be able to prevent that. I guess it would help if we somehow came up with a style of voting that relies on voting for ideals rather than an individual to remove any bias, but I doubt this could be easily implemented.
November 9, 2016 4:20 p.m.
FIREphaenix says... #13
You speak a different story to what I hear on the Media and see on the media. But, after all, the Democrats control the Media. I personally don't trust Trump or Clinton, but I think Trump is slightly worse. What about his speech though? Changed courses a bit, didn't he? I'm Aussie BTW.
November 9, 2016 5:01 p.m.
I feel like I'm comparing myself to Sigarda, Heron's Grace because:
She fought with the humans against Avacyn's madness (and eventually Brisela, Voice of Nightmares and Emrakul's hordes) and never left their side.
Sigarda gave the humans hope during one of their darkest times. Being the last uncorrupted archangel puts you in that position. She also went out of her way to protect him, adhering to her duties pre-SOI.
I feel the same way. All I can do is fight back against this tidal wave of hatred. Maybe I'm being a bit arrogant for comparing myself to Sigarda but, during times like these, there needs to be a symbol of hope out there that represents the good in the world that's worth bleeding over. Sure, I might be a small voice but nothing significant happened when the perpetrator was alone. It's not about Trump; it's about fighting the hatred that is deep-seated in the US.
Alright, I've done my dramatic speech for the day, back to playing with some cards. :p
November 9, 2016 5:36 p.m.
I hate trump but I'm pretty sure he won the popular vote as well as the electoral vote
November 9, 2016 8:16 p.m.
Just remember hate never leads to good actions. The best of both sides prove this, love and compassion strike clearer than anger and division.
November 9, 2016 9:37 p.m.
Truth. OK sure.
Trump: Hey America! There may be no better expert in the world for leading us through official bankruptcy! Does that sound "perfect right now"? Gee maybe by some definitions of the word.
Clinton: Maybe being part of widespread creepy corrupt unaccountable government doesn't sound that bad ... until you get to be on that list of targets. Yikes but that's a whole lot of " not-democracy"!
Speaking of democracy, who gets to be included and excluded in ours for the next 4?
I almost want to applaud "the first woman in office" except that one of her big unofficial "selling slogans" is "vote for Billary". Um. Term limits? Dynasties? Does a woman have a hope based on her own merit in the public eye?
So instead of smiling and nodding while "boys will be boys" we get the full uncouth version unfiltered from Trump. I see no revolutionary difference. I'm screwed either way.
I could not bring myself to give a vote of confidence to either!
Silver lining for me: government is constituted by more than just one personality. Local government may determine the course of life experoence more immediately than higher government. Our school referendum passed! Super!
Yeah ... Senate, house, AND presidency - so change is about to happen for sure!
I need to not talk about this subject at all. I am not helping. I should make a poem or cartoon instead.
November 9, 2016 10:26 p.m.
If he didn't win the popular vote the media would be all over it
November 10, 2016 12:59 a.m.
I voted Trump because Hillary is evil. Like...Trump is red...but hillary is RB...nuts and evil. No thanks. Trump for life.
November 10, 2016 1:24 a.m.
Hillary did win the popular vote. Not much to do now but watch and wait for eight weeks, then four years.
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/11/09/501393501/shades-of-2000-clinton-surpasses-trump-in-popular-vote-tally
By the way, I can't get the hyperlink to work.
November 10, 2016 1:32 a.m.
VampireArmy says... #22
People are burning cities and razing hell over this. I'm sickened by those people. Those are the type of people who gave a man like him seriously. When you live in a world full of recreational outrage, no one is going to take you seriously with actual outrage. Go ahead, sore losers, take your aggression out on innocent property owners.
I refused to vote. The whole thing was a joke to me from the start but the jokes old
November 10, 2016 2:21 a.m.
Hillary voters preach intolerance then burn the world when they don't get catered to.
November 10, 2016 4:47 a.m.
EpicFreddi says... #24
I don't know much about politics in the US, but I can say one thing for sure: give him a chance. You can still burn down everything AFTER he fucked up, but as of now he can still turn out the be an "okay" president.
November 10, 2016 4:54 a.m.
Okay, a few things. One: he did lose the popular vote, but it was by an incredibly fine margin. Like, less than 200,000 votes. Two: people may complain about candidates winning off of Electoral College votes instead of popular vote, but there's a reason presidents are elected off of the electoral college - if elections were based on popular vote, the entire election would hinge on three or four states. Three: Hillary herself has stated that Trump deserves a fair chance at being president, and if his own opponent is willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, then I am too.
November 10, 2016 10:43 a.m.
Just another example of how usa needs to get rid of the electoral college. It is an archaic system that was, and is, designed to stifle the will of the people. This is the 2nd time in recent history the prez didnt win the popular vote.
November 10, 2016 10:57 a.m.
I can't believe people that are supposed to be all about peace are shooting each other. Democrats claim to be the intelligent ones, but they are the ones destroying everything. Trump is the president now. Get over it. This is just another example of how terrible this country is now. It's too full of hipsters and internet warriors. And THAT has nothing to do with Trump. This is exactly how the country reacted when that armed robber (Michael Brown) was killed by a police officer, after attacking the officer. Internet doesn't agree with the law? Destroy the country.
November 10, 2016 12:16 p.m.
As a non American recently learning more about your voting system there is one thing that really boggles me. The electoral vote system. States like California always votes Democrats, right? Texas votes Republican, right? Then a vote for Democrats in Texas is a vote that doesn't count at all? There is really no reason for a Republican to go vote in California since it will most definitely turn out in the Democrats favour?
If Democrats gets 60% of the votes in a state, then 40% of that states votes doesn't count at all? This seems like a huge fail in terms of democracy to me. Every vote should count, the popular vote should determine the winner.
That being said, one should ALWAYS respect the outcome of an election. Trump won. I fear for my own safety due to this outcome, and i live on the other side of the world. But i do respect him as a winner (even tho i question the electoral vote system and think Hillary should have won due to popular votes).
November 10, 2016 1:01 p.m.
Yep, you said it, smackjack.
The electoral college is a Remnant from the bad old days when only rich white landowners were allowed to vote, because they knew better than the common man. It is specifically designed to make votes worthless.
It makes the votes of people in states with larger populations worth more than those in smaller states. A vote in California is worth 55 electoral college votes. Thats a bit over 20% of 270 electoral colleges needed to win the election! While smaller states in new england (NE USA) only have around 10 electoral college votes, or 3.7% of the 270 needed to win.
The college also amplifies the affects gerrymandering, but that is a whole other pile of shit
November 10, 2016 1:16 p.m.
BabyK: Michael Brown was an unarmed 18-year old boy who got shot to death by the police. There is no reason not to get upset about that. Internet doesn't agree with the law? I have a hard time believing the police who killed the boy had the law on his side. Also, "destroy the country", sure, riots are not a good way of getting your voice heard, but if there are reasons behind it then its at least understandable (still horrible). One should take a step back and think about the underlying reasons behind an event like Ferguson, and try to understand why this is. Its most often the drop that overflows the bucket, and its much bigger than this one incident.
November 10, 2016 1:16 p.m.
griz024 Is there any questioning of this system in the US? Seems to me this is something that would enrage and engage alot of people..
November 10, 2016 1:26 p.m.
Sadly no. Most Americans are too busy keeping up the Kardashians or whatever the lastest celebrity gossip is to care. In fact, when i bring it up to people several have never heard of it.
I, on the other hand, am very pissed about it. I have tried to raise a stink several times, but all my letters to congressmen fall on deaf ears.
At least the democrats have a reason to get mad about the college, but since the GOP controls 2/3 of the government i didnt see it happening within the next 4yrs.
I have hope however. It took the USA almost two centuries to have direct popular votes to elect senators. They were elected by state legislature till 1913. 17th amendment to our Constitution, i believe, is what changed it.
November 10, 2016 2:19 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #34
If your answer to injustice is to burn and loot innocent people's property, you have a sick and twisted ideal of what's moral.
November 10, 2016 2:45 p.m.
VampireArmy I guess your answer was to me, and as a response ill repeat myself saying its horrible yet understandable. Two totally different things.
November 10, 2016 3:31 p.m.
I don't get how anyone has a problem with the electoral college. As already stated, if the popular vote decided the president then a few states would hold the vast majority of the decision, screwing the smaller states out of having any effect on the election. It's set up to be as fair as possible for everyone.
November 10, 2016 3:47 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #37
smackjack you're not the only one with that mindset but yes and no. It's not understandable. It's the furthest thing from making sense or being understandable. Do you know who they are hurting when they do this shit? Not the police, not daddy big bucks, but their own communities. Burning down local businesses (some even owned by minorities) only kills the community more. I'm watching this shit unfold in my own state of California and it's sick. Harming innocents is never understandable and never condonable. Once you step into the threshold of destroying property and looting, you're not only a child who can't handle your temper tantrum, but also a criminal
November 10, 2016 4:03 p.m.
We want more people to control the choice of the president not fewer. There is no need for the electoral college.
November 10, 2016 4:24 p.m.
VampireArmy again, Its horrible acts (as i stated), but I can understand the frustration underlying those acts, even tho its horrible. I expect you to understand it too since you take the debate with me, but too often ive debated this with people where the argument ends in "kill those niggers" (thats probably why i continue this discussion right now since i know you are probably not that kind of people). Understanding why the Furginson riots happened is very important in getting the whole picture and a fair view of the world we live in. Its horrible and not at all justifiable to burn down local businesses, and i have never stated it to be ok. But i can understand where the rage comes from and THAT is important if you want to understand the conflict in a wider sense.
November 10, 2016 4:27 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #40
I don't offer the umbrella of "well I get why they did it" of course I do but I don't excuse it and no American should excuse it as much as they should excuse police brutality. I've lived in 4 different states in the last 5 years from the west coast to the east among every conceivable races and cultures. I've seen the inner cities and how divided it is. When you sit there and give them the "I see why they do it" you're not only treating them as children but also giving them that leverage to continue doing it. Especially because the people doing the rioting aren't doing it for the victims, they're doing it as a free excuse to pillage. That's something you'd have to live there to understand. The victims don't want this.
But let's also focus on the fact that parts of California were literally set on fire because the orange idiot was elected. No victims, just angry children who wanted another Democrat in office.
November 10, 2016 5:21 p.m.
mymanpotsandpans says... #41
Completely removing the electoral college would be a terrible decision and go against the framework of founding Fathers. (While they have arguably failed in areas this is not one) If you have a problem with this system, then I might suggest looking towards the removal of unit rule laws and go with the congressional district method of distributing electoral votes. Maine and Nebraska both use the congressional district method. It would also be a fallacy to believe that popular vote means anything and should mean anything for winning electoral votes with the other 48 states. Yes population indirectly goes into the possible electoral votes a state has but it is not the actual method for determining the numbers. 24 states have voter initiatives, so for anyone that feels outraged or disappointed by the results of this election it may be within your interest to support a change. California by chance has voter initiatives and seems to be the most outraged. Burning your own cities down is something that third world trash would do. The system has answers and violence sure is not one of them. Personally I am ecstatic that Trump has won, not for any political advantage to myself. I hope this ends up being a valuable lesson to eligible voters and more people start paying attention to all levels of political discussion.
November 10, 2016 5:25 p.m.
VampireArmy I think we misunderstand each other. I think it is as horrible and inhumane to behave like this as you do. I don't mean its understandable in an encouraging way, but in a philosophical way. I hope you do realise that you have no clue how it is growing up in, or being a minority in Ferguson. Just like i dont know how it would be. I do sympathise with the minorities who are affected by this election, but I'm not personally affected negativity at all.
November 10, 2016 5:39 p.m.
mymanpotsandpans Yes i think that every vote should count in a democracy, and if that goes against the framework of your founding Fathers then fuck your founding Fathers, really.
November 10, 2016 5:49 p.m.
mymanpotsandpans says... #44
smackjack every vote does count, also this is a republic don't for a minute mistake this for a democracy. If you think votes are not being accounted for I would suggest contacting your state legislature and start there.
November 10, 2016 5:56 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #45
smackjack I never claimed to know Ferguson but I will state that not a ton of people ever feel the effects of an election personally unless you happen to rely on certain systems like (in this case) Obamacare. Now I can't speculate what it is to be another person but I personally have lived in areas where white is a minority of the cities population and experienced what that brings. From that standpoint, I think I can at least imagine. Still. Anger is not rational so it's not effective to try to rationalize it from any standpoint.
November 10, 2016 5:59 p.m.
mymanpotsandpans says... #46
smackjack I add this, I hope you are angry. That may sound bad but I think it there is something constructive to be found in all of this.
November 10, 2016 6:03 p.m.
mymanpotsandpans every vote does not count, it it were so then Clinton would have won since she got more votes. I respect your voting system don't get me wrong... And im sorry for using Democracy wrong, I did a google search and apparently US is not a Democracy (wow!!). That raise the question why the hell not? I see you as an advanced country, yet you are below Poland in human rights. Goddammit!
November 10, 2016 6:05 p.m.
VampireArmy "not a ton of people ever feel the effects of an election personally" Tell that to the baltic countries who are right not sitting labs for Putin since US wont have their back (according to Trump campaign). Or tell that to all the minorities Trump have hackled during the campaign, i bet they feel real safe and sound right now...
November 10, 2016 6:09 p.m.
... Not forgetting Poland, a country left without defence over night...
November 10, 2016 6:11 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #50
The first thing you're not understanding is that nothing in us politics happens overnight. It took Obama 8 years to mostly handle what bush left. On that merit, don't be surprised if orange supreme goes back on his word with a lot of those countries in the coming weeks/months
Secondly, the president doesn't control individual communities or even have that large of an impact on them. What? You think just because he said some shit on TV that means that every closet racist is going to go apeshit and massacre minorities? No. They won't because that's not how it works. Feeling unsafe because he's president is beyond irrational in that regard.
greyninja says... #2
To put myself further out on a limb; I voted for Bernie Sanders in the primaries. I think if he was the Democrat nominee then things would have ended differently.
November 9, 2016 11:59 a.m.