Improving Ezuri
Commander Deck Help forum
Posted on Nov. 9, 2015, 8:08 a.m. by Crayfish
I plan on getting the Commander 2015 deck "Swell The Host" , and I was thinking about improvements. I plan on putting Momir Vig, Simic Visionary in along with some Simic power cards, but what else should I add? I am going to try to get my friend's Mycoloth and Sage of Hours because the interactions between them and Ezuri are too good to pass up. I would imagine swapping my Hangarback Walker out of my standard deck is logical, because... value.
Also, Infinite Reflection + Timberpack Wolf = Value.
I would love to hear your suggestions! Thanks!
---Crayfish
Gidgetimer says... #3
Ezuri, Claw of Progress for those who don't know the brand new cards off the top of their heads.
November 9, 2015 9:45 a.m.
Gidgetimer says... #4
Master Biomancer seems like a bit of a non-bo with Ezuri for experience counters. Once you are at a place that you feel you have enough experience counters he would be good to make your guys enter big though.
November 9, 2015 9:50 a.m.
I think Master Biomancer fits in just fine. For example, lets say you have 4 experience counters and you cast Master Biomancer. That will trigger his first ability and you'll now be at 5 experience counters. When you go to combat Ezuri, Claw of Progress's second ability will trigger and you'll put 5 +1/+1 counters on Master Biomancer. Now every creature you cast after that will enter the battlefield with 7x +1/+1 counters already on it. Sure this stops triggering his first ability and you won't gain experience counters as your guys enter, but at this point it's irrelevant because your army is already huge. Not to mention you get to continue putting more counters on at the beginning of every combat. So until they answer your Master Biomancer you just put more counters on it at the beginning of every combat so that your creatures continue to enter the battlefield as giant monsters.
I guess if Master Biomancer was the first creature you cast after ezuri was in play then it'd be kind of a non-bo, but not really a true one. It would still work and produce the effect you want, it may just require a couple of turns to get the counters on your biomancer instead of being able to just put a large chunk on at one time. Essentially just slowing you down and not necessarily creating any unfavorable interactions.
It's the same principle behind everyone's suggestions to add Mycoloth to the deck. While it doesn't actually trigger ezuri's first ability, it generates value once you start putting counters on it.
November 9, 2015 10:08 a.m.
Dredge4life says... #6
Yes, but if they answer Biomancer after all of your guys come into play you lose all of the value. You can't magically regrow experience counters. That said, unchecked Biomancer absolutely wins the game, so it's up to you.
November 9, 2015 9:14 p.m.
Deck list please.
Master Biomancer is counterproductive to Ezuri's effect. Regarding above comments, Mycoloth itself doesn't trigger Ezuri the turn it enters, but its token swarms do.
Gyre Sage, Fathom Mage, Zameck Guildmage, Gilder Bairn, Viridian Joiner, Contagion Engine, Contagion Clasp, Triumph of the Hordes, Joraga Warcaller, and Avenger of Zendikar all have good interactions with Ezuri and his ability. I would also add in all four basic elf mana dorks, as well as Birds of Paradise and Bloom Tender for ramp. One of the reason green is the best color in commander is because of its absurd mana ramping abilities. It's best to take full advantage of that in nearly every green-splashed deck.
Tutors for Sage of Hours are always good. Green Sun's Zenith, Chord of Calling, Birthing Pod, Fauna Shaman, Survival of the Fittest, and Yisan, the Wanderer Bard are all good options for allowing you to consistently get the needed creatures.
November 9, 2015 11:51 p.m.
After many playtests on tappedout and looking through my cards, here are the cards I have compiled that are candidates for "Swell the Host".
Swell the Host (C15) <---Decklist
Avenger of Zendikar: We have a good amount of ramp, so this guy only serves to make a ton of experience counters.
Primal Command: Value
Courser of Kruphix: Predicting my next turn and negating land draws? Yes please.
Chord of Calling: Tutor up whoever I want, whenever I want.
Yisan, the Wanderer Bard: Helps me pull more things out of my library.
Wildwood Rebirth: Resurrection spells are helpful.
Curse of the Swine: Remove their huge threats, or exile tokens to get more experience counters? Win-win card.
Zameck Guildmage: Card Draw? Seems good, but not a first pick from me. Added at a friends request
Whisperer of the Wilds: Ferocious is not hard to obtain in this deck.
Avatar of the Resolute: 2 green for a 3/2 with trample, reach, and can be huge on entry? Hell yes.
Bioshift: Saves counters from removal or kills a Hangarback Walker risk free.
Dragon Throne of Tarkir: Dump tons of +1/+1's onto a creature, then tap it to pump up your entire team. I might have found a home for you, my dragon throne...
Hangarback Walker: Value. Pure Value. NEXT!
Hooded Hydra: See: Hangarback Walker.
Doubling Cube: More ramp into a huge Walker, Hydra, or Hatchery? Fine by me.
Vorel of the Hull Clade: While I cant double my XP counters (/cry), I can use him to make huge creatures even bigger. Value.
Back from the Brink: I would like to use my creature again, thanks.
Mystic Genesis: Expensive for a counterspell, but can make a huge slime if timed correctly.
Index: Prior Planning is Key.
Progenitor Mimic: Breaks ETB effects, makes tons of XP counters, loads your board with creatures. Its hard to pass up.
Kiora's Follower: Untapping Sol Ring is fun. Untapping stuff is fun. Fun fun fun.
Nimbus Swimmer: Combined with some other cards mentioned here and in the deck, this thing can get huge, FAST.
Elusive Krasis: Triggers Ezuri and is unblockable. Yes plz.
Unexpected Results: This card is great. No matter what you pull, it always screams value! (Unless you pull the walker or a hydra. /cry).
Death's Presence: Recylcing is key. Kill my biggest dude? My other dude gets BIGGER! Mwahahahahah.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary: Auto-Include, Amirite?
Beguiler of Wills: In most of my playtests, I have been able to get a ton of creatures on the field. Being able to steal my biggest threats sounds... fun. :)
Urban Evolution: Value
Beetleform Mage: Quick and easy. Triggers ezuri and has on-the-fly evasion. (No pun intended)
Shambleshark: Its everyone's favorite beer-belly, fish-crab, and flash-evolve mutant!
Bred for the Hunt: When its so easy to get +1/+1s on my creatures, this is basically just pure aggressive value.
Krasis Incubation: Lock down an opponents creature? Give my creature two +1/+1s? Win-Win!
Icefeather Aven: Triggers Ezuri when it hits the field as a morph, and allows you to potentially get another XP counter. Value.
Kiora, the Crashing Wave: Here, her ult isn't as amazing, but her +1 and -1 do wonders. Seems like an auto-include.
Plasm Capture: I got both this card and Kiora damaged from a friend who spilled water on his duel decks. Im going to glue swamps the the card backs and make playable without sleeves. Anyway, This is nothing but value. Ramp and counter rolled into one. VALUE!
Horizon Chimera: With all the card draw, this guy will make sure you are stocked up on life.
The next few cards are... well... expensive. But they could work well here. I will let you judge on whether they justify their cost.
Platinum Emperion: This is the "Screw you, target someone else" card. People won't attack you when your life total can't change. (Usually...)
Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur: Paired with "No maximun hand size" cards, Jin is just amazing. Not only does he provide you with more cards then you would ever need, he screws over the opponents. Unless they topdeck some removal, you can play your turns without the worries of what the enemies have in their hands.
Arcanis the Omnipotent: More Card Draw. Woooooo.
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger: I wanted to make an EDH around him, but damn is that manabase expensive. So why not sub him in here as a finisher? He gets the job done.
Quicksilver Amulet: Enabler for the cards listed above.
Cards I plan on getting:
Sage of Hours: Infinite turns with Ezuri. (Trade)
Fathom Mage: Value with Ezuri (Trade)
Mycoloth: Must I explain? (Trade)
Gyre Sage: So... much... green... (Buy).
So what else should I buy? What else should I try to get? What cards are actually good here, and what cards are crap? Most importantly; WHAT SHOULD I REMOVE?
Thanks!
---Crayfish
November 11, 2015 8:43 p.m.
@Dredge4life actually no you don't lose all the value if they kill your Master Biomancer. If you have just a measly three +1/+1 counters on Master Biomancer then all of your creatures after that entered the battlefield with five +1/+1 counters. Those counters will stay after Master Biomancer is finally answered, so instead of a bunch of 2/2's you'd have 7/7's. I'd say that's solid value right there. Also, not sure if you realize this but, experience counters don't go away. So if you only have 3 experience counters after you cast Master Biomancer then you'll still have 3 counters when it finally gets answered.
November 12, 2015 3:29 a.m.
Dredge4life says... #10
I am aware experience counters don't go away. If there are any counters on Biomancer that exceed two, then you will not get an exp counter for any of the creatures entering the battlefield.
November 12, 2015 6:39 a.m.
Gidgetimer says... #11
Its not that there has to be more than 2 counters on Biomancer it is that his base power is 2 so even 1/1s won't give you experience counters. With a commander like Ezuri, Claw of Progress you are going to be building around his abilities. Shutting off the first ability does you a great disservice. Let us suppose that your turns go:
- Ezuri
- Three 2/2s
- Biomancer, Add the counters to Biomancer, Two 2/2s that enter as 7/7.
- Ten 1/1 Saprolings that enter as 6/6
Now you have had four turns with Ezuri and your opponents decide they have had enough of your shenanigans. I don't know about the people you play with but in my group sweepers are much more likely than targeted removal so a Wrath of God puts you with nothing on the board and 3 experience counters. Now if the Biomancer had been a Mycoloth Devouring the 2/2s and no more creatures that turn, you would have an empty board and 22 experience counters. A much more scary thought when Charging Badger and Ezuri come down the next turn.
If you wait and play Biomancer when you have 10+ experience counters he doesn't hurt you too much, but you don't want to have to play correctly for it to not hurt. You want things to be good when played without thought and blowouts when played correctly.
November 12, 2015 7:41 a.m.
Dredge4life says... #13
I personally think Biomancer is a win-more in most scenarios.
November 12, 2015 11:52 a.m.
SkylordAleksander says... #14
Why not run Doubling Season and Contagion Engine? Doubling season can't double your experience counters, but it will double the counters you get from them. and Contagion's double proliferate is just bonkers, and you can proliferate your experience.
November 16, 2015 2:44 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #15
Doubling Season is a good idea, but Contagion Engine is bad and I don't think Ezuri is going to be the deck that changes that. If proliferate worked like Vorel of the Hull Clade's ability it would be be worth it. But paying 10 mana for 2 experience counters is garbage, and you are never going to catch up to just normal token generators because it is 4 mana to get 2 experience counters and most token generators are 1 mana per point of power. Making ones that trigger ezuri at least 2 counters per 4 mana, if not more. If Contagion Engine cast for 
it might be worth it but it doesn't
November 16, 2015 3:18 p.m.
Gidge, you have to keep in mind that Contagion Engine also wipes an opponent's board over the course of several turns, not to mention buffs creatures who already have counters on them via Ezuri's ability. But yeah, 6 mana initial investment +4 per activation is rough.
November 16, 2015 3:36 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #17
I realize that it adds the -1/-1 counters. I just haven't seen many decks that would care about that at all. And the ones that do have artifact removal. I guess the additional 1/1 counters on the creatures that are already buffed may be worth something, but not much. I stand by my statement that Contagion Engine is bad and this isn't the deck that is going to make it at all playable.
November 16, 2015 4:03 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #18
I feel like you're underestimating the power of Contagion Engine. The card is busted. The fact that it gives -1-1 counters to every creature an opponent has is rediculous. It adds up, trust me. It's also a mans sink and an on-board combat trick. I would definitely add it.
November 16, 2015 4:08 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #19
Okay, picture this: there is a Prossh, Skyraider of Kher on the table. You play the engine, target him, he sacs all his kobolds or 1/1's on your turn, and anything that survives gets increasingly smaller. Engine is incredible for sheer value, which is what you want for Ezuri.
November 16, 2015 4:12 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #21
Every creature target opponent controls. So it is only going to effect one deck. Name a single commander that cares. I honestly can not think of one but my playgroup also runs strats that don't win over multiple combats generally. Contagion Engine is no where near busted it is a bad card that isn't made any better by being considered for this list. I have given my opinion on why it isn't good in my previous comments.
If you would like me to take your opinion seriously I would like reasons and examples beyond "trust me" because frankly that isn't a reason. If I know you it may be enough to convince me, as it is you could be on the PT or an 8 year old that learned to play yesterday. I have no reason to trust you and as such I don't.
November 16, 2015 4:22 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #22
I have not seen a single prosh list that would sac the tokens to prosh on your turn. They have other places to sac them to for pure value. Let me look up a Prosh deck to see if maybe I am misremembering the decks though since I don't play against one on a regular basis.
November 16, 2015 4:25 p.m.
SkylordAleksander says... #23
On top of that, Vorel only targets one creature for two mana, with Contagion you get to add 2 (or 4 with doubling season, 8 with Hardened Scales) to ALL your creatures, and your Experience, and more on the -1/-1's that you put on your opponent. So you can pay 2 colored mana to add to a creature, or 4 colorless to add across the board
November 16, 2015 5:09 p.m.
SkylordAleksander says... #24
And I'm just spitballing ideas. The Engine has done me very well in my Bant Superfriends deck, but I also have the storage lands that it adds too, and lots of untaping shenanigans that lets me use it multiple times per turn. So I haven't tried it in this deck yet. But with other token adding effects it're pretty awesome. and even if Vorel is a better card for buffing one creature. You can only have one of him. A major thing i like to consider in EDH decks is repetition. Have two or 3 cards that do the same thing if it is vital to your strategy. So having another artifact around that can help pick up Vorel's slack if he's not around isn't a bad idea. Plus this deck ramps through mana pretty well, so the 6 drop with 4 to activate shouldn't be a problem. Plus both blue and green have ways of untapping lands on other turns which is super useful
November 16, 2015 5:15 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #25
Although I am opposed to the thought of a superfriends deck (I feel walkers are over rated) that might be the one deck that Contagion Engine isn't absolute garbage. I don't feel that this deck benefits from it at all. It is too slow for experience counters and I feel that for 10 mana you should be able to win the game not put yourself in a slightly more advantageous position.
November 16, 2015 5:24 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #26
They sac the kobolds in response, because otherwise they would die.
November 16, 2015 6:35 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #27
I can assure you I'm not 8 years old, and I have never been to a Pt, but Contagion Engine is a good card, and it's perfect for this deck. I can't tell you how to build this deck, I'm just asking you to try it. In my experience Contagion Engine is a fantastic card. It instant kills x/1s, slaughters elves, goblins, and token strategies. Just try it.
November 16, 2015 6:41 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #28
Also, for the record. Krenko, Mob Boss, Ezuri, Renegade Leader, Ghave, Guru of Spores and Prossh, Skyraider of Kher.
November 16, 2015 6:43 p.m.
PookandPie says... #29
I like how there is a huge conversation about various win-more cards. Yes, Contagion Engine is win-more. If you drop it, and it sits out for an entire turn for you to add 2 -1/-1 counters to somebody's creatures and +'s on your own, then you were already in winning shape. If your playgroup is slow enough to warrant it, then run it by all means.
I'd recommend running things like Cyclonic Rift, Evacuation and Devastation Tide (remember: You keep your experience counters, so bouncing everything affects you much less than anyone else). Don't forget Beast Within, Capsize and Song of the Dryads for removal, because you don't want to get caught dead to combo. On top of that, you have your counter spells, Prophet of Kruphix, Seedborn Muse, Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and other little things you'd need to not get completely demolished in a multiplayer setting.
Adding two experience counters and messing with the mono white player's board is nice, but lots and lots of decks like to combo out and that is where Contagion Engine either will not help or is purely win-more. If your meta game is all beatdown... then by all means. If you can't tell, Gidge's meta is pure combo and control, so he typically has to deal with getting locked out of playing Magic from the third turn forward or being unable to stick a single creature, let alone several for the purpose of proliferate being useful. This is a stark contrast to, "I'd like to spend 10 mana to get a couple extra counters on my stuff that's already stuck and kill one guy's tokens."
November 16, 2015 6:43 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #30
If you want an example, it kills Elvish Mystic, Mother of Runes and all of Master of Waves's tokens.
November 16, 2015 6:48 p.m.
PookandPie says... #31
Don't use Prossh as an example of Contagion Engine being good. A well-built Prossh deck would have Food Chain and would've killed you before you could have assembled the 10 mana for a Contagion Engine activation (barring some kind of one sided Mana Crypt + Mana Vault + Sol Ring opener or something).
Similarly, Contagion Engine is useless against a well-built Ghave because that deck doesn't want to win on the combat step, and instead wants to drop Ashnod's Altar, Geralf's Messenger, etc., and then make you lose all of your life on the fourth turn (or literally twenty some other combos. Toss in Young Wolf and Blood Artist, toss in Phyrexian Altar, it doesn't matter lol).
Contagion Engine isn't good against combo, and if you're playing against non-combo Prossh or Ghave, you're playing against a deck that was purposefully built to win slower than it effectively could.
November 16, 2015 6:49 p.m.
Contagion Engine actually works pretty nicely in Brago, King Eternal. Being able to activate it, blink it, then activate it again goes a long way toward that though. I use Contagion Clasp in my Marchesa, the Black Rose deck. While it doesn't add counters to things that don't already have them it is a way to grow most if not all my creatures when dethrone triggers become hard to come by. I can also do it at instant speed along with other combat tricks to make sure I trade favorably after blockers are declared.
I'm considering the clasp in my ezuri deck. The target -1/-1 counter help's slow down a large creature one player has so you can focus attacking on another safely. Plus, as small as only 1 addition experience counter may seem it definitely will add up. Especially when we're talking about converting it into +1/+1 counters. In a Meren of Clan Nel Toth deck, for example, it wouldn't be as useful because you only need to reach the highest CMC in experience counters (there is no bonus for having more than that barring gaining control of another creature that cared about them) Plus in a swarm type strategy I see it being more likely that my counters get spread out across the team as they enter or it becomes beneficial, making it a pseudo anthem effect for all my creatures already with counters on them and something to sink mana into when I have nothing else.
November 16, 2015 7:02 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #33
Okay, I will agree that engine is a win-more, and if you're playing against combo decks it's really bad. I've kind of been arguing just for arguments sake, I'm glad someone has set me straight. My bad lol, sorry.
November 16, 2015 7:02 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #34
But engine is not bad. I will not say it's garbage, because it's not.
November 16, 2015 7:03 p.m.
Dredge4life says... #35
Our plagroups are obviously very different. Yours is very combo-oriented, whilst I get hated out because I run Jace's Mindseeker and Deadeye Navigator.
abenz419 says... #2
Just a few things I can remember off the top of my head that I've started to get together for my Ezuri deck are Master Biomancer, Wild Beastmaster, Vorel of the Hull Clade and Managorger Hydra. I've already got a handful of cards set off to the side that are all potential includes, but these are some of the ones that stood out as big benefits in the deck (at least that I can remember right now).
November 9, 2015 9:42 a.m.