Custom card 2-player cube
Custom Cards forum
Posted on Aug. 26, 2019, 7:24 a.m. by Boza
I love drafting and 2-player drafts are particularly awesome. I often play Cube Winston draft with a great Peasant Cube. However, that cube is designed for larger drafts and some themes you might hope to be supported, may just not appear.
Rules for Winston Draft Show
So, I had the idea that the only way to make a good Winston cube is to make one from scratch. So, I want to make a 100% custom card cube specifically designed for 2 player drafts.
But I need advice for it. First things I thought of to get some advice on:
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How many cards? Usually around 90 to 100 cards are enough to make a 2 player deck. However, more might be needed for variety and to not be able to predict what happens. 120? 150? 200?
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Given the size of the cube (unknown now), what should the color distribution look like?
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Given that this cube will be made specifically for the 2-player Winston draft variant, should there be any mechanics refering to that ala draft-matters mechanics from Conspiracy? Any ideas about those?
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Rarity will not be a concern, but I am receptive of any ideas for the cube or any concerns with the idea.
DwaginFodder says... #3
- 90 cards would be enough if you want the draft experience to always use the same pool of cards. If not, then I'd suggest 1.5 or 2 times that number (135 or 180). Having recently build a full-size custom cube, I can say that it's a PAIN to hit those numbers with any sort of synergy, so that number is also roughly dependent on how devoted you are to the idea.
- Color distribution should be even, but the number of multicolored cards you want is dependant upon your mechanics and archetypes. A 360-card cube with themes in all ten two-color combinations will generally use 50 cards of each color, 50 multicolored cards, 30 nonbasic lands, and 30 colorless cards. Thus, with a 90-card Winston cube, I'd suggest 13 cards of each color, 10 multicolored cards, 7 colorless cards, and 8 nonbasic lands.
- Conspiracy mechanics are entirely up to you.
- With how strange a Winston draft is comparatively, you might want to consider limiting your colors by cutting one or two. See the article put out by Wizards a week or two ago about that Grixis Cube on MtGO.
August 26, 2019 9:31 a.m.
Caerwyn, This thought have never crossed my mind, but it can be an interesting angle. I had to look up ante for an exact definition:
407.2. When playing for ante, each player puts one random card from their deck into the ante zone after determining which player goes first but before players draw any cards. Cards in the ante zone may be examined by any player at any time. At the end of the game, the winner becomes the owner of all the cards in the ante zone.
Typically, Winston cube drafts would consist of drafting and a best of 3 match after deckbuilding. Since ante is a random card, I would say that it is not super impactful over the course of the games, but I have thought of a way to incorporate it: Deckbuilding challenges (DC).
At the start of the draft, one DC is randomly selected. If ante is selected, players would be forced to make 43 card minimum decks and make a 3-card ante. At the end of the game, the winning player takes all those cards in the ante and adds them to their sideboard. Between games during sideboarding, you use your remaining cards to make another 43 card deck.
There could be a lot more challenges like this and this can be a way to introduce a good amount of variety in both Regular and Custom Winston drafts.
August 26, 2019 9:38 a.m. Edited.
I was thinking you would have a few strong Artifacts/other colourless cards that could easily be spotted into any deck. For example, , , Ante a card from your hand: counter target spell with CMC, x or less, where X is CMC of Anted card.” Or Lotus Bloom where you ante it, not sacrifice it.
Little tiny cards that have decent effects and could easily be slotted into decks on the fly.
August 26, 2019 9:50 a.m.
DwaginFodder, thanks for the feedback!
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135 seems to a good starting point. And thank you for the distribution table, this is a great starting point!
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As much of a Nicol Bolas fan I am, cutting colors is probably not something I would do. I read the article, but I am not convinced the idea has merit. Cube, even at peasent level, has a host of playables, but losing colors means losing avenues to victory.
If you have any ideas for mechanics or anything, I am completely open to ideas. Thanks for the feedback!
August 26, 2019 10:15 a.m.
DwaginFodder says... #7
Oh, one more thing: If the cards within your cube are not meant to be used with anything else, they should be powered accordingly. It's up to you to decide what power level your cube is on, and your removal and fixing and bodies can be at literally anywhere relative to mana cost. You don't have to balance them according to common knowledge or existing cards, because they aren't going to be played with them at all.
Also, remember that with a Winston cube your players may not have the same size pools and decks will often be three-color.
August 26, 2019 10:23 a.m.
The problem I see with ante cards as proposed is that for game 2, you would have to refill your deck back to 40 if you lose. In 1on1 draft, where you have lots of chaff and barely scrape some playables, this can be very swingy. And this is issue is exacerbated in game 3.
I am definitely putting it on the list of mechanics for sure, but I will have to solve several issues before including it.
August 26, 2019 10:26 a.m.
DwaginFodder - I have played a lot of Winston Peasant draft in the past year or so, so the two notes on pool size a general tri-color-ness have been noted already.
You are right, however, I would not strive too far from the color pie and current power level, as that would increase Analysis Paralisis, aka the time to draft would increase drastically.
I have heard that Maro once had an idea of a standalone set where cards like the power 9 would be of mid power level. But that seems too dificult to design. Some boundaries will be pushed, but nothing too groundbraking. If the initial experiment is successful, version 2 can push boundaries a lot more.
August 26, 2019 10:42 a.m.
As a note, I will posting any updates to the cube in this thread or a separate one for feedback. The project timeline is about 4 months and I will try to get people in the FLGS to test the cube.
August 26, 2019 11:35 a.m.
MoonHollow124 says... #11
Try to choose the allied or enemy color pairs. Give each color pair a strategy that is similar to the ones it shares a color with. Ex. Boros Tokens and Orzhov Aristocrats. For each color pair, add 2 or 3 multicolored "signpost" cards that point players in the direction you want them to go for the draft. I like the ante idea. Also, don't use artifacts as a theme because you'll have to dedicate a lot of your already limited slots to colorless cards.
August 26, 2019 10:49 p.m.
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guiding the pool towards color pairs is a good possibility, as restricts current options, while allowing future ones. Sharing goals betwen colors is also a great idea.
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Signpost uncommons are not possible in Winston draft.
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I do not get what is bad about having more colorless cards, but it is something to keep in mind.
Thanks and keep the suggestions coming!
August 27, 2019 4:51 a.m.
I have updated the top section to include the rules of Winston draft. to add to that, here a few mechanics that are a possibity during drafting:
- Pile on - Note the number of other cards in the pile at the time you draft this. Gets some kind of effect depending on the number.
Very similar to the draft-matters mechanic of Conspiracy sets, it can include some more varied effects to distinguish it.
- Lucky draw - if this is the only card in a pile you draft or drafted from the top of deck, reveal this card.
Rewards players for drafting smaller piles or getting lucky.
- Redraft - when looking at this pile you may reveal this card. If you do, remove it from the game, replace it with a new card and start drafting from pile 1 again.
Some mechanic that will allow players to rethink what they draft.
- over/underdraft - if you have drafted less than 45 cards, get an effect. If you have drafted more than 45 cards, get another effect.
Since you do not draft equal numbers of cards in Winston, something to reward this aspect of drafting will be great.
Any other ideas for mechanics that can be used specifically for the Winston draft prior to actually playing?
September 3, 2019 7:33 a.m.
Trying to use this topic as a design/development diary.
So, I have thought about how I want to build the different colors and the answer was to focus on tricolor and have more multicolor cards. All tri color combinations will be difficult to pull off, so I decided to go with Khans clans:
- Sultai - Zone control, aka caring which zone cards are in.
- Mardu - midrange-focused with efficient plays, leaning more towards aggro.
- Jeskai - Heaviest control, least creatures, most spells and enchantments
- Temur - Pure aggro/tempo, low curve, stealth, assissination.
- Abzan - Focus on graveyard and midrange, leaning towards control.
Next update, I will share some example cards for each to highlight how they play.
Caerwyn says... #2
I have never made a cube, so I can’t talk about the practical deckbuilding elements, but there is one mechanic I always thought would work great in a custom cube event: Ante.
I feel Ante would add a fun additional element to a cube, since you’re constantly adding new cards to your pool/loosing cards from your pool, so you have to adjust your deck accordingly between games.
August 26, 2019 9:19 a.m.