Riding The Land Craze For Cube Purposes
Custom Cards forum
Posted on Feb. 23, 2015, 9:03 a.m. by pookypuppy6
Yes, another cocking land design. But this is an important question and has practical use:
I a constructing my Super Multicolour Cube Of Deadly Death and unfortunately, I cannot afford shocklands. This is an especial bummer as the basic land subtypes are what I want; not just for making Safewright Quest rather good, but also adding to the Domain subtheme.
I came up with the idea of creating custom cards for the Cube at a later date (sensible designs I hope), and I realized that this would also help me solve my dual-land problem. I could design lands with the subtypes I need and print them and proxy them at little cost! And it would give my multicolour cube a slightly ore unqiue identity too!
BUUUT designing new dual-lands with those basic land subtypes is...umm, tricky and hard as you may well be aware. I find dual-lands tough at the best of times. Here's my attempt, please pass on your likely negative thoughts:
So let's explain my crap choices, with the consideration that this is for a Limited environment and not for Constructed. I originally thought "why not discard a card for that cost instead of paying 2 life like the shocklands", but then realized graveyard-based decks would eat that up for dinner. I changed it to the above, with seems less abusable and means you don't lose your kickass card you discarded to get your Azorius Guoldmage out Turn 2, but you did delay your draw to a yet-to-be-seen card, which I think is far less salty if annoying.
Balanced? Reasonable? Submit your own shockland-aping designs for me to consider?
pookypuppy6 says... #3
@lemmingllama: Huh, I didn't actually consider that this could hide cards from targeted discard spells (though it'd be more likely Castigate than a Thoughtseize in the multicolour cube). It could even save you from multiple discard, like someone trying to Skull Rend you, but you keep your card on top of your deck and only discard the one card, say. Not a common occurence by any means, but interesting titbit.
I keep trying to find stuff wrong with the design. For example, I worried over Skyward Eye Prophets gaining card/land advantage off of it... except it doesn't really, as it's already six mana and three colours and you can probably put the thing in untapped anyway. Or that self-mill cards could interact with it like Sultai Soothsayer... but that still means you are digging through one less card you don't know about, and that kind of interaction actually seems kind of cool rather than busted.
February 23, 2015 9:17 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #5
OOH OOH OOH I got one. Coiling Oracle works pretty well with it! Although again, you're still only revealing that land rather than drawing into your next card.
February 23, 2015 9:24 a.m.
MagicalHacker says... #6
If only Miracle decks could play these lands! XD
But seriously, these are well designed. Not broken, very playable. I like it.
February 23, 2015 9:24 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #7
Oh yeah, Miracle decks and Narset, Enlightened Master and Unexpected Results would have a field day. The Cube doesn't have Unexpected Results in it, coincidentally.
Here's another pair. Because I love being challenged into giving names to dual-lands. THE ABZAN COLLECTION AWAY!
February 23, 2015 9:39 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #8
Oh whoops, Unexpected Results shuffles before it does its thing. I totally meant Polymorph. Yeah, Polymorph. Totally Polymorph.
February 23, 2015 9:40 a.m.
Would be especially great if you had something like Terminus in your hand to put on top of your library. I could see people abusing Miracle abilities with those lands. Still cool though.
February 23, 2015 9:59 a.m.
CharlesMandore says... #11
Oh yeah, suddenly becomes a planned strategy. That may be a bit powerful. Is miracle in the cube at all?
February 23, 2015 10:06 a.m.
lemmingllama says... #12
@CharlesMandore I believe he said it was a multicolored cube, and I don't remember any multicolored Miracle cards.
February 23, 2015 10:14 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #13
Not at all. The Cube's only planned non-evergreen keywords are Flashback, Domain and Sunburst (though wither and -1/-1 counters unfortunately make annoying appearances).
February 23, 2015 10:14 a.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #14
Thanks for the feedback by the way, guys! I will offer thee a peek at one of my designs as gratitude.(though it is also revealed in another thread).
February 23, 2015 12:07 p.m.
You have designed taplands that I might actually be willing to play. And I HATE taplands. This is excellent.
February 23, 2015 12:09 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #16
Thanks! Though, I'm curious as to what you think of shocklands since they are also essentially taplands and near-identical to these lands but with a less obtrusive cost.
February 23, 2015 12:16 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #17
Does anyone have their own shockland-style designs, by the way What other kind of drawback could justify untapping a dual-land?
February 23, 2015 12:38 p.m.
MagicalHacker says... #18
I think I made one in the past where you had to exile the bottom five cards of your library. Or something. Or maybe top five, but that's more abusable. Idr.
The idea is that aggro decks don't care what they exile, but control decks tend to lose if they play some combo as their finisher and they exile all their pieces.
Another cool one I guess would be draw then discard a card at random. Dual land is untapped if you bad-filter?
February 23, 2015 1:47 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #19
@MagicalHacker: Hmm. Again, my first thought was discarding a card (without the draw upside), but I feel that discard at random could leave a bad taste in the mouth. Especially if it discarded away your land to play your spells.
February 23, 2015 1:58 p.m.
MagicalHacker says... #20
Well you don't lose card advantage, but you undo a dig. Honestly, I think I might like it for some decks, namely aggro or graveyard based decks, but it goes to show that these "Tibalt lands" are still unlikable xD
February 23, 2015 2:33 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #21
Wow, we've come up with "Miracle Lands" and "Tibalt Lands".
Whatever could be next? "Bloodrush Lands"? "Jace Lands"? "Bear Lands"?
I did design Echo Lands for one of my sets, they were WEIRD.
February 23, 2015 3:02 p.m.
@pookypuppy6: Shocklands aren't really taplands; two life is almost irrelevant. (Coming from an EDH/Modern perspective.) These have an actually relevant downside if you want them coming in untapped, but it's one that also has the potential to be worked to your advantage in a variety of ways.
February 23, 2015 3:06 p.m.
what if it read: When (land name) enters the battlefield, you may put a card at random from your hand onto the top of your library. If you don't, (land name) enters the battlefield tapped.
February 23, 2015 3:14 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #24
Hmm, not sure. Losing the card you're about to cast is just irritating. Say you play your Lush Plateau untapped to get the green mana you need for Kiora's Follower Turn 2... but you randomly had to plink your Kiora's Follower on to the top. That would be hella upsetting.
Actually, for that very reason I think that a random hand-reducing effect cannot really go on a land like this at all. The randomness does help ensure no stupid things happen in bigger formats, but can really be unfun in disassembling your own early plays. I think picking and choosing is better overall, though not always better in isolated cases.
February 23, 2015 3:21 p.m.
pookypuppy6 says... #25
Does anyone like the Stingtail Butcher, by the way? I'm kinda enamored with it, it's a Giant Scorpion but with the conversion to red mana it becomes more aggressive.
February 23, 2015 3:50 p.m.
jandrobard says... #26
I've seen your cube, and these would be fair, but not too highly picked due to the high element of aggro in it.
February 23, 2015 6:53 p.m.
Well, hopefully not having them be highly pickable isn't a bad thing; I'd rather they stuck around and be drafted by player with bombs in those colours rather than be first picked and then abandoned as that player goes down different colours. As long as they are not busted or completely unattractive/unplayable, they should do the job of instant fixing when you need it (unlike all the other nonbasic lands in the Cube).
I would highly appreciate how you analysed the Cube's propensity towards aggro, as this Cube has gone under very little real-world testing and gameplay and feedback is fantastic from those more knowledgeabe than I am.
lemmingllama says... #2
This is definitely balanced. As I see it, it's just a guildgate with an upside if you need it, and in an ideal situation you can also hide cards from Thoughtseizes and such. I'd say to go for it
February 23, 2015 9:07 a.m.