Infinite Combo?
Deck Help forum
Posted on Sept. 5, 2013, 8:21 p.m. by mirkwood
I have a deck that is almost complete and a friend and I came across some interesting combinations of cards. Notably we are concerned with whether having Soul's Attendant, Rhox Faithmender, and Angelic Accord cause there to be an infinite combo when life is gained. Is it? Any help would be much appreciated.
hunter9000 says... #3
No, Angelic Accord only triggers once per turn, at the beginning of the end step. You would get a 4/4 Angel, Soul's Attendant would give you 1 life, and Rhox Faithmender would double that to 2 life.
September 5, 2013 8:24 p.m.
Deck link? And no it wouldn't cause a infinite life cycle.
September 5, 2013 8:26 p.m.
No. Here are some infinite life combos
Soul's Attendant , Leonin Relic-Warder and Phyrexian Metamorph .
September 5, 2013 8:34 p.m.
Two Soul's Attendant on the battlefield along with one, or more, Rhox Faithmender (s) and an Angelic Accord . If I play Angel's Mercy and gain more than 4 life I'd have a 4/4 Angel Token enter the battlefield. As soon as that token hits the battlefield I gain 4 life (two per Soul's Attendant due to Rhox Faithmender . Would that not trigger an infinite life-4/4-angel combo?
September 5, 2013 8:39 p.m.
I just want an infinite combo that is all white that deals with Soul's Attendant , Rhox Faithmender , Angelic Accord .
September 5, 2013 8:41 p.m.
No. Angelic Accord only triggers once at the beginning of the end step, not whenever you gain life during the end step.
September 5, 2013 8:44 p.m.
http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/End_step
http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Triggered_ability
Well?
September 5, 2013 8:46 p.m.
At the beginning of the end step, the Accord says "Did you gain 4 life? If yes, make an angel" then it stops. That is the only thing it does, all turn. It doesn't matter if that angel gains you four more life, the "start of the end step" already happened, and the Accord already triggered. There is no way to chain instances of gaining 4 life with Angelic Accord to generate infinite anything.
September 5, 2013 8:57 p.m.
Let's see if this makes it more understandable to you. You gain 6 life this turn. At the beginning of your end step Angelic Accord 's ability will trigger and you will get a 4/4 angel token and gain 4 life from 2x Soul's Attendant and Rhox Faithmender being out. You do not get to use Angelic Accord 's ability again though, regardless of how much life you gain, because it only triggers at the beginning of your end step. Which is when it triggered the first time. You can't start your end phase, trigger abilities, and then restart your end phase in order to trigger that ability again.
September 5, 2013 9:06 p.m.
It happens for one instant, at which time anything that triggers then triggers.
It's a step, so it has a duration, and things can happen during it, but it only has one beginning.
September 5, 2013 9:31 p.m.
Gotchya.... so what combo do you think I could use from 2013-2014 that could give me an infinite token/infinite life combo?
September 5, 2013 9:35 p.m.
there is no time... once you've finished your second main phase, then it's the beginning of your end phase which consist of 2 steps, then end step and the clean up step. During your end step, the game looks to see if there are any triggered abilities, such as Angelic Accord , and they are put on the stack. Both players then have the option to play any spells that the could play legally. Once all spells and triggered abilities have resolved you move on to the clean up step. The clean up step is simply the time at which all damage counters are removed from creatures and you discard if you have more than 7 cards. No spells are played at this time because no one has priority. The only exception is if there is a triggered ability that triggers during the clean up step. Typically both steps (your entire end phase) lasts only as long as it takes you to say "I'm done", "pass", or "your turn".
September 5, 2013 9:41 p.m.
There are no infinite combos of any sort in mono white in the last year.
September 5, 2013 9:46 p.m.
What do you mean by legal sets? Every set is legal within at least one format. However, if you are asking about standard, the answer is no.
September 5, 2013 9:53 p.m.
RickyHoeppner says... #20
This made me think. Say you have a Healer of the Pride and a Rhox Faithmender out along with Angelic Accord . You use Congregate . At your end step, Angelic Accord shits out an angel. Wouldn't that angel officially hit the battlefield once your end step is over, in other words, on your opponents turn? Which means it is a new turn, so she would hit the battlefield triggering your Healer of the Pride to get you another angel during your opponents end step, then yours, then his, then yours? Or does the angel simply hit the battlefield at the exact same time Angelic Accord is triggered?
September 6, 2013 1:17 a.m.
The angel enters the battlefield during your end step
September 6, 2013 4:37 a.m.
No. The end step is still your turn. The angel would enter in your turn. The end phase lasts as long as need to. The beginning of the end step is only an instant where abilities are put onto the stack.
If you gain 4 life in their turn (from between their untap step to their main phase 2) you will get an angel at the beginning of their end step.
September 6, 2013 4:44 a.m.
@RickyHoeppner: The Angelic Accord says: "At the beginning of each end step put a 4/4 white Angel token with flying in case that you gained 4 or more life this turn.". So the token enters the battlefield right at the beginning of the end step, not after it. The end step still belongs to that turn, and if you gained 4 or more life, this ability triggers. Since the token entered the battlefield, it triggers also the Healer of the Pride (with Rhox Faithmender ) and you gain extra 4 life right at the beginning of your end step. So this new 4life gain still belongs to that turn, not to the next one.
September 6, 2013 5:28 a.m.
cartwheelnurd says... #25
Actually after the end step the turn is not over. There is still the cleanup step.
September 6, 2013 8:23 a.m.
RickyHoeppner says... #26
I wonder if there are any cards similar to Healer of the Pride that give you the life at the beginning of the NEXT end step. It would say something like "When this creature enters the battlefield, you may gain 4 life at the beginning of the next end step" or something of the sort.
September 6, 2013 2:56 p.m.
Angelic Accord says that "at the beginning of EACH end step..." so I would assume that if you gained 4+ life during your opponents turn at the beginning of your opponent's end step you WOULD gain another 4/4 Angel token with Flying.
September 7, 2013 12:28 a.m.
@Mirkwood: this is a correct statement. However it's still not the opponent's end step, if you put a token into the battlefield during YOUR end step. It's still considered as YOUR turn, so you don't get two tokens.
September 7, 2013 4:26 a.m.
RickyHoeppner says... #29
Yes yes I know this. So thats why it would be cool for there to be a card that would gain you life on the next turn and you were somehow able to make it so you would gain a token on each turn forever.
September 7, 2013 4:37 a.m.
@RickyHoeppner there are cards, they just don't specifically say on your opponents turn. like Angel's Mercy . If you played this card during your opponents turn, before their end phase started, and gain 7 life. then at the beginning of their end step you'd get another 4/4 angel. There are plenty of cards that you can gain life with on your opponents turn. Your example from a few comments ago wouldn't work though unless the creature had "flash", You can only play creatures on your turn so if it said "when this creature enters the battlefield, you may gain 4 life at the beginning of the next end step". Then the next end step would be your end step and you wouldn't be gaining life on your opponents turn like you thought. Also, if the gain life ability didn't trigger till the beginning of your end step I don't think Angelic Accord would trigger. Someone more awake than I am right now would have to verify but at the beginning of your end step the gain life ability would trigger and go on the stack, and Angelic Accord would also check to see if you had gained 4+ life simultaneously. Which means when it checks to see if you had gained enough life to trigger the ability you wouldn't have gained any life yet because it was on the stack getting ready to resolve.
September 7, 2013 10:27 a.m.
hochmaster says... #31
Boros Reckoner +Rootborn Defenses +Gift of Orzhova . Deal damage to Boros Reckoner somehow (by using him as a blocker, for example) then cast rootborn defenses in response to your declaration of the reckoner as a blocker. Damage will be dealt to him, you can deal that damage back to him over and over again. Since he has lifelink and indestructible, he won't die. Mono-white Infinite life.
September 7, 2013 3:31 p.m.
@hochmaster... holy crap!!! That's incredible!!! I'm gonna have to try that one. Pulling that off with Rhox Faithmender x4(?) would be an incredible life gain tactic. Opponents would only be able to forfeit because it wouldn't stop. Brilliant!!! Thank you!!!
September 8, 2013 2:30 a.m.
RickyHoeppner says... #33
Ive always wondered how that worked. Would you win, or would it be a tie because the game literally cannot end.
September 8, 2013 2:33 a.m.
Boros Reckoner +Indestructibility +Gift of Orzhova , Moment of Heroism , or pretty much any other card that grants lifelink is an infinite life combo, in mono white, that is standard legal.
September 8, 2013 2:44 a.m.
joshhightower says... #36
@RickyHoeppner... Since the infinite combo is determined by the player (ie. choose to have Boros Reckoner deal the damage to himself to gain the life and keep the combo going), the player can choose to damage another creature or player to end the combo. So basically, you choose how long you want the combo to go on and how much life gain you want, then you end the combo and play normally. I believe there are some ways to get other combos like that in an infinite loop that cannot end; in that case I believe the game is a draw.
September 8, 2013 2:52 a.m.
RickyHoeppner says... #37
Thats so funny. So basically, you gain as much lifw as you feel like declaring. Until you run out of breath or you lost your voice (probly like 3,000 life). Theeeen you continue playing. Any sane player would give you the game. I would be that guy and make him keep playing.
September 8, 2013 2:56 a.m.
joshhightower says... #38
I would shoot for more like 10000001000000 life, just in case he has a Quietus Spike or something on hand to ping you back down. You would still have to worry about them hitting other win conditions like Door to Nothingness , Battle of Wits , milling you out, etc...
September 8, 2013 3:07 a.m.
joshhightower says... #39
That was supposed to be 1000000 to the power of 1000000 btw, lol. I guess it strips the caret char.
September 8, 2013 3:08 a.m.
joshhightower says... #40
I have a mono black infinite combo deck that I just built. It gives infinite mana and infinite +1/+1 counters. I have fun feeding the infinite mana to Diabolic Revelation and playing every card in my deck at once. It still needs some work with the supporting cards though. Check it out if you like.
Here is the link: Magus of the Infinite
September 8, 2013 3:12 a.m.
hochmaster says... #41
Well, infinite life is overrated now, because Master of Cruelties .
September 8, 2013 4:24 p.m.
Samuel_The_Seer says... #42
Knock them down to a quarter of their life total in one hit =)
Kizmetto says... #2
you only make 1 angel a turn with Angelic Accord
September 5, 2013 8:24 p.m.