Targeting rules
General forum
Posted on May 28, 2024, 5:51 p.m. by Kryn_Winterbourne
So I have a question about certain effects and the order in which they resolve. The situation I'm wondering about is say I have a creature that becomes the target of a spell. In response I decide to sacrifice that creature after having cast an instant myself which states "When target creature dies or is put into the graveyard, return that creature to the battlefield."
What I'd like to know is how long I can wait before resolving the return effect? Can I wait until said spell targets a new legal target or fizzles out? Or do I have to resolve the return effect immediately, thus making the creature a legal target again?
ouroborobelisk says... #3
If an opponent casts a destroy spell on your creature, and then you cast a spell in response that will return that creature, both spells will go on the stack. Your spell will resolve first targeting your creature, then your opponent's destroy spell second. Your creature will be destroyed then be returned to the battlefield as your spell resolves. That's how the scenario should play out. If you have a creature & an opponent targets it and you flicker it in response, your creature enters the battlefield as a new creature despite being the same card. Either way your opponent's spell will fizzle because it no longer targets a legal target as your creature was exiled & is no longer there. I hope I helped explain that interaction for you.
May 28, 2024 6:55 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #4
There is a rules Q&A on the site, it has some added functionality like the ability to choose an answer and is frequented by some highly knowledgeable users so your question will get answered and the answers will be double checked by the other knowledgeable users. I'm sure one of the mods will move the thread soon.
You seem to have a couple of misconceptions here, so I'm going to try and address all of them in a way that makes it easy to understand what is going on.
Once targets are chosen for a spell or ability the targets will not change (unless another spell or ability instructs someone to change the targets). If, when a spell or ability resolves, none of the declared targets are legal (this could be because they no longer exist) the spell will simply fizzle.
Spells and abilities resolve one at a time in "First In, Last Out" (FILO) order and there is a round of priority when new spells or abilities can be added to the stack between each object resolving.
Once a spell or ability starts to resolve it resolves completely before anything else can resolve.
If a card changes game zones and then returns to a previous zone, it is a new game object with no relation to its previous existence.
Using card names to make this easier to track what would happen in the scenario you are asking about:
An opponent casts Murder targeting your Gutter Skulk.
You cast Undying Malice targeting Gutter Skulk.
Undying Malice resolves. (FILO order)
You sacrifice Gutter Skulk to Ashnod's Altar to make mana.
Delayed trigger created by Undying Malice goes on the stack.
Delayed trigger resolves returning Gutter Skulk to the battlefield. (FILO order)
Murder attempts to resolve and fizzles because none of its declared targets are legal. (Spells can't retarget without an effect changing the targets; Gutter Skulk on board has no relation to the gutter skulk that was targeted)
May 28, 2024 7:18 p.m.
Kryn_Winterbourne says... #5
Thank both of you for the help. To clarify, the exact situation would be if my creature was being targeted with a spell to exile it. But knowing now that the return effect will resolve first and thus make the creature a "new" creature with the same name that can't be targeted by the exile spell causing it to fizzles it great to know.
legendofa says... #2
Welcome to the club, Kryn_Winterbourne! There's a dedicated rules question area here.
Let's say you have a Walking Corpse. You cast Return to Action targeting it, and Return resolves. An opponent casts Disperse targeting the Corpse, and you sacrifice it one way or another.
The order of events, assuming nothing else happens, is:
You cast Return to Action on Walking Corpse. It resolves, and Corpse gets the "When this creature dies" ability.
Opponent casts Disperse targeting Corpse. This locks in that target, and it can't be changed later.
You sacrifice Walking Corpse. This triggers the "When this creature dies" ability granted by Return to Action.
The "When this creature dies" ability resolves, and Corpse returns to the battlefield.
The target for Disperse is no longer valid, so it fizzles. Because the returned Corpse is treated as a new game object, it's not considered to be the same object that was targeted earlier.
Basically, when a card moves from one zone to another (battlefield -> graveyard and graveyard -> battlefield, in this case), it "forgets" all previous effects it had. It's not targeted by Disperse, and it doesn't get the +1/+0 and lifelink anymore. Also, effects happen in the opposite order that they're used. The newest effect is the first to resolve, and the oldest effect resolves last.
May 28, 2024 6:51 p.m.