Will we see less cards depicting disease/plagues due to the pandemic?
General forum
Posted on March 14, 2021, 6:42 a.m. by StopShot
Magic for many of us is an escape from reality where you can channel your creativity into a fantasy-like setting. It can be a form of escapism that can help us forget about the real world problems we face just to enjoy a fun game with friends. The problem is, what happens when a minor aspect of the game, such as black's ability to cast debilitating and infectious diseases, hits a little too close to home with the current pandemic affecting the globe?
This thread isn't advocating for black to stop depicting disease in cards but to bring discussion on if the pandemic in any shape or form could affect the theme of diseases being used in game and, if so, to what extent? The pandemic's death toll isn't something that can be ignored easily and for some of us we may know of family members or friends or family members of friends who have succumbed to it. Magic can be a great source to distract from hard times, but if a card depicts the very thing that is troubling you it can potentially be a massive turn-off when playing.
So I wish to ask, how do you think this particular subject might be handled going forward? Do you think Wizards will try or has tried to mindfully avoid the subject of disease/plague for other similar black effects like mass-fear or mass-pollution, etc? Do you think the pandemic may hurt the chances of certain planes returning back to standard in the short future? How would you feel about the concept of disease and plagues being featured less in Magic cards? Do you think this is a non-issue that shouldn't bother anyone?
enpc is right. 99.9% of the time if there is a plague reference its has to do with the story not with global events. People need to remember that this is a fantasy game and not compare to the crap going on outside.
March 14, 2021 8:51 a.m.
King_marchesa says... #4
Lol I’ve opened two ikoria boxes and in both of them I got a spacegodzilla death corona.
March 14, 2021 9:07 a.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #5
enpc, Dromar39, I agree with those statements, and I am almost afraid to address a sensitive subject, but should that not have meant that cards such as Imprison , Cleanse , and Crusade should not have been deemed taboo, since they are in no way related to real world events?
March 14, 2021 9:47 a.m.
I think we will probably see a downturn of these types of card for the immediate future, and I would be surprised if we see such cards in the next year or so. I think the majority of the players would be fine with plague-related cards now (barring the rather unfortunate coincidence of "Death Corona"), but there are plenty of click-baity sites that cover Magic that would run with a "Wizards is being insensitive again" story, and I am guessing they are inclined to avoid that.
Still, plagues are still an important part of fantasy, history, and Magic, and archetypes like pox tend to be fairly popular. I would expect that, after a suitably respectful period of time--determined by a corporate risk-reward calculation--Wizards will return to printing and reprinting cards with viral themes.
Mcat1999 - TappedOut is not the place to spread misinformation, conspiracy theories, and demonstrably false information about COVID-19. There are plenty of younger users who read this site--I'd rather they not see posts that make them unsafe. Besides, as I have told you multiple times, there are plenty of places on the internet where you can post your.... extremely questionable political analysis. TappedOut is a Magic forum--not a forum for airing grievances about politics.
If you feel the need to respond, please do so on my wall so as not to spam this thread or any more public-facing element of this forum. I do not guarantee I will respond if you post there; but I can guarantee I will not if you post here.
March 14, 2021 10:14 a.m.
FormOverFunction says... #7
I think we’ll see slightly less disease-related stuff, but it will be (a) whatever they take out of their upcoming sets worked on this past year and (b) not making new ones in the new sets they work on over the next year or so. I feel like this will be an all-or-nothing change; either we’re going to move on the way we always have or it will be formally put in our faces forever (because there will always be another virus or bacteria). Just a few American non-disease topics that no one here ever though would be forgotten: Pearl Harbor attack, JFK, Florida drug wars, all of the floods/tornadoes/hurricanes in the past ten years. This has been bad (as bad as it can get, for some) but I don’t think it’s going to stick any more than anything else.
Magic cards may be moving away from “hey man, grab that encyclopedia and find me another word for ‘crater’ will ya?” and more towards “which plansewalker name are we putting in front of the word ‘caldera’?” anyways. I seriously never thought I would see another fumarole.
All things considered, I really hope they make more natural disasters. Especially white ones. And blue ones that aren’t just bounce and tap effects.
March 14, 2021 11:01 a.m.
RNR_Gaming says... #8
If wizards censors or holds back on anything it'd be to appeal to the chinese market.
March 14, 2021 3:07 p.m.
DemonDragonJ: There's nuance here though. The cards you've listed were banned due to either racist undertones or to historical events which some construe as racist. And while historical events should always be evaluated in the context of their day (i.e. nuance is required here too), the justification for the ban was at least clear.
Here, the 'cleanest' line of argument for plague themed cards being banned is: "MtG has plague themed cards, there is a current pandemic whihc is bigger than any other recent pandemic, I know somebody who died becuase of the pandemic, I'm angry at any reminder about the pandemic, ergo, I am angry at WotC for having cards which remind me of this."
This is very clearly a stretch, as the same argument could be that the game in general depicts death and somebody might be upset about the death of a loved one (from a COVID unrelated issue). But this very dangerous, as it's not WotC's responsibility to ensure that they don't upset anybody about anything. Additionally, it's important that we push back on people arbitrarily projecting offense about things. Nobody wins in these situations. Again (like with all things) emapthy and nuance is required on both sides, but the diea of being offended does not immediately make you in the right and the other person in the wrong. The basis of the claim should actually be assessed and then people should move forward from there.
As I mentioned before, at least with the banned cards, they directly referenced either racist slurs or themes (like Invoke Prejudice ) or were a direct reference to a specific event (in the case of Crusade ) rather than a general plague theme.
And look, I know there are a lot of discussions around painting all these cards with the same brush despite being banned for different reasons, however (and without derailing the conversation to talk about the banned cards) there were better ways that WotC could have handled all this.
March 14, 2021 8:06 p.m.
jamochawoke says... #10
I would hope not.
Black still has problems with perception due to Demons being its big flashy card-type (like red has Dragons, white has Angels, etc) and zombies as its staple (like red has Goblins, white has Soldiers, etc). It feels like all black does is dark depressing hyper-evil when that's not indicative of what WotC originally laid out for the color even if it's part of it. It also has some of the craziest brutal artwork, especially the older stuff. I'm actually pretty glad when I see black take other thematic turns like plagues (or other natural disasters)/shadows/nightmares/mind control (paranoia and fear)/big brutes/assassins/dread knights and warriors/rogues and thieves/death+life magic/void stuff or just selfish or power hungry characters. I actually really want to see black take some different themes that represent the color more than just "evil power" since when you look at the original color pie descriptions it's less about that and more about the philosophy of taking what you can when you can and seeking power for personal or obsession reasons rather than empathetic reasons.
(Funny to note, I was told that's why MtG invented the Horror subtype and only had Horrors for a while in black instead of Demons, because it got such huge backlash from christian parents super upset about their kids playing with cards that had demonic imagery and they slowly reintroduced demons back in over time after that died down.)
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Also, Mcat1999, ... I've had covid-19 twice now (march 2020 and feb 2021) and almost died from it both times and I have a long recovery after this last one. The person who gave it to me the second time, my landlord, died in the hospital albeit he was a smoker. I'm not the healthiest person (I was overweight when I first got it and lost 45 lbs and have some mild chronic issues) but I'm also young and have weathered many, many flus and other illnesses before no problem. This thing absolutely whipped my ass. My friend's parents who are both in their upper 50s now both got it as well and they didn't have any issues outside of a strong cough for a few days and some breathing trouble and dropped energy levels afterwards. It really is bizarre how this thing affects different people.
And no, I'm not offended by "Death Corona" title for space godzilla or images of plagues. To be so is fairly silly.
March 15, 2021 12:36 a.m.
BlackSirius says... #11
Honestly I never even thought about it, so with that, probably not. I figure with things like this they would use a form of focus group to test the liability of it, but I'm sure it would be mostly inconclusive. To draw that line would be a stretch In my opinion. But, there's a card of Garruk looming over a Liliana (after some of the shit she did to him), and someone drew a way out there connection that it was toxic masculinity. So, who knows it could go either way.
March 15, 2021 7:28 a.m.
Mcat1999 in regards to Spacegodzilla, Death Corona, WOTC never promised a physically printed card named Spacegodzilla, Void Invader.
What they promised was that the Death Corona version would be removed from future Ikoria reprints as the initial release could not be stopped, that MtG Online would not be releasing physical versions of the card via treasure chest, and that the name of the card in MtG Arena would be changed to SpaceGodzilla, Void invader.
Pepperidge Farm doesn't even have to remember that, it's literally the first page that pops up if you google search Spacegodzilla, Death Corona.
enpc says... #2
I don't think that you can hold WotC repsonsible for people making a connection between a fantasy card game which reference plagues and the current COVID situation. And I don't think that it's WotC repsonsiblity to not print cards that refernce generic plague themes.
I also think that it's a bit stupid to get upset about Spacegodzilla, Death Corona since Corona is just Spanish for crown (and calling COVID19 "Coronavirus" is actually just referencing a type of virus, not a specific one).
Viruses are a part of life and while we are dealing with a specific pandemic right now, viruses in general won't all go away when COVID does.
Ultimately I think that the responsiblity is on the player that if a card is making them upset, then the onus is on them to not play the game, not blame WotC for 'triggering them'. And in addition, part of the high death toll that the US has been facing is due to their mismanagement of COVID which again is not WotC's fault.
I get the point that you're making, but I don't think any of the current cards in circulation are in bad taste. If WotC release a COVID themed card, just like if they released a 'School shooter' card or something then that would be overstepping a line. But I really don't think that's the case here.
March 14, 2021 8:40 a.m.