Monastery Swiftspear in Delver?
Modern Deck Help forum
Posted on July 14, 2015, 4:18 a.m. by Cyncro
Hey all. I play a version of UR Delver in Modern (I know Grixis is putting up numbers right now) and I don't have access to Snapcaster Mages. Is Swiftspear still viable in UR Delver in Modern?
JexInfinite says... #3
I don't think Delver is a playable deck without Snapcaster Mage, especially UR, which needs Snaps to be even remotely comparable to Grixis.
July 14, 2015 5:15 a.m.
Servo_Token says... #4
You can 100% play UR delver without snaps and with swiftspears. You might have a harder time beating some decks, but there's zero reason to not give it a go.
July 14, 2015 9:01 a.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #5
@JexInfinite Snaps actually aren't that imperative in Delver -- sure, they're nice, but they're basically curve-toppers. So, some lists play as few as 2 Snaps. You can definitely do without them, but you'd be lacking some amount of late-game stability.
Mitigating that stability with an extra bit of aggression (Swiftspear) seems fine to me, but I do like to have some Snaps in the list.
July 14, 2015 10:43 a.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #7
Also, Grixis Delver and UR Delver are hardly comparable, tbh.
Grixis aims to control the board (Terminate) and land a huge delve threat, while UR Delver relies much more on a tempo gameplan. Basically, grixis is like a more midrangey Delver deck.
July 14, 2015 10:45 a.m.
Which is why Grixis Delver's metagame share is dropping, and Grixis Control's is going up. The future of Delver is either 
or 
, if you ask me.
As for the OP's question... You can definitely make good use of Monastery Swiftspear in Delver, but it will require a bit of a shift in mindset. You're going to want to cast lots of spells such as Lightning Bolt and Thought Scour on your turn in order to provide it with the pump it needs to do good work for you, and loading up on cheap sorceries like Gitaxian Probe, Serum Visions, and maybe even Forked Bolt or Flame Slash, depending on what creatures you have to get rid of. Because of that, I'd also recommend Disrupting Shoal, so that you can keep a counter up even when tapped out. If you're afraid of running out of cards (a legitimate concern), I'd try Day's Undoing as a way to reset your hand. Hope that helps.
July 14, 2015 5:28 p.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #9
IMO, a deck playing Swiftspear and blue should also be playing 3+ Young Pyromancer.
Also, rothgar13, I'm not a fan of either Disrupting Shoal or Day's Undoing. The rest of your suggestions are spot on tho.
Don't forget the Blood Moon in the sideboard!
July 14, 2015 7:22 p.m.
SwaggyMcSwagglepants says... #10
I think it would be OK un delver. It doesn't work in Grixis, so yeah.
Swiftspear is good in tempo, so you should be loading up on burn spells and tempo counters like Remand.
Also, I do think a 1 of Day's Undoing is pretty good. Most of your stuff should be instant speed, so it's not the greatest loss in the world.
Personally, I'm going to be running 2x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Flip in my grixis delver deck, since I'm in the no Snapcaster boat as well. It takes time, and is sorcery speed, but gives you up to 2 flashbacks and loots a bit.
(Also, if you want to tell me Jace sucks, go to my page; I don't want to see this forum become a Jace is good / Jace is bad forum)
July 14, 2015 10:12 p.m.
If there's any deck in Modern where Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Flip will see play, it's Delver, so I don't mind throwing in there for a test run. And yeah, Day's Undoing is a 1-2 of in the deck, tops.
If you don't believe in Disrupting Shoal in Delver yet, don't just take my word for it - check out Jordan Boisvert's "Monkey Grow" Temur Delver deck (which took down a SCG IQ in Worcester). That deck has put up some nice results, and he swears by Disrupting Shoal.
Deck Primer: http://modernnexus.com/welcome-to-the-jungle-mandrills-in-modern/
July 14, 2015 11:15 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #12
While I think Disrupting Shoal is a solid card, I find the issue with it to be twofold. First, you two-for one yourself by losing a card as well as a counter to keep your opponent's spell from resolving. Secondly, you rely on the luck that you will have a card with the same mana cost in hand as your opponent. Again, it is a good card, and what you're saying seems good to me, but I would tend to think that Pact of Negation is generally its better.
July 14, 2015 11:18 p.m.
buildingadeck says... #13
I got the costs confused on Pact of Negation and Slaughter Pact. Nevermind. Disrupting Shoal is the 0 mana counter for Delver.
July 14, 2015 11:22 p.m.
allthingsMTG says... #14
rothgar13 that's why i am going to be Climbing on the delver train
buildingadeck says... #2
In straight UR, I think so. I recently got beaten by UR Delver, and I'm pretty sure it ran it.
July 14, 2015 4:23 a.m.