Calling B/G-Mages! What do? Jund, Junk, Rock?
Modern forum
Posted on Dec. 8, 2014, 10:21 a.m. by Putrefy
Hello everyone,
I'm calling fellow B/G/x-players to assist me. Recently Modern was dominated by decks running some combination of blue or red or Pod-Decks. However as some examples have shown, B/G-based decks are still capeable of posting good results. Willy Edel went 3-1 with his Abzan Midrange deck at WCM and we had another Abzan list getting Top8 at the latest GP in Madrid.
However with the resurgence of Pod and U/R based decks (not control) being another major player, one must ask him/herself, if Abzan is really the place to be. We all know, that Siege Rhino is a big new threat, that's not easily handled. But is it good enough to play 4 Siege Rhino of your own, when Pod-Decks also play them but can "cheat" them into play much more easily? Rhino is very good against Pod. It has trample, it's huge, they cannot (easily, only with Dismember) remove it. But what do you do, when they start podding up their own Rhinos? You suddenly have a staredown, with the difference being, that they have basically infinite Rhinos and you have to hope for the top card of your library to be good. That's not a winning position... So how can we beat Rhino-Pod as B/G/x-players?
I say go back to Jund. Lightning Bolt is awesome right now with all the delver-decks running around. Anger of the Gods tears Pod and Delver apart. You still have the awesome discard-shell that's so good against all the combo-decks (Scapeshift, Storm, Valakut/Through the Breach) and Control (Kiki-Control, Blue Moon, UWR-Control). The only real downside: you don't get to play Rhino and Souls and you sideboard is significantly weaker (everybody knows white has the best hate).
One thing however is absolutely clear: You don't want to play Dark Confidant right now. It has been some rough times for good ol' Bob lately and it isn't going to change anytime soon. You simply cannot support him in such a hostile/aggressive environment. More often than not you'd die with spells in your hand. At which point Bob was useless, heck even helped your opponent.
Another thing that's rather clear to me: you want some reliable source of lifegain. Be it Siege Rhino, Scavenging Ooze, Courser of Kruphix or Huntmaster of the Fells Flip. And that's the starting point for me.
You take the shell:
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Thoughtseize
1x Duress
4x Abrupt Decay
And then you add in: Lightning Bolt, Anger of the Gods, Courser of Kruphix, Huntmaster of the Fells Flip and you have a nice midrange-deck, that's strong against Pod with Anger of the Gods, strong against U/R Aggro decks with Courser of Kruphix, Anger of the Gods, Lightning Bolt and also good against the other decks mentioned above (Control/Combo).
I don't have an exact 75 yet, but I think right now is the time to switch from Abzan to Jund. Playing regular Siege Rhinos is very good, however it cannot beat cheated Siege Rhinos.
Please let me know what you think, especially fellow B/G-mages!
Regards
GlistenerAgent says... #2
Again, not what you want to be doing. The goal of your creature base is to be incredibly efficient. Voice is a guaranteed two-for-one, but not really exciting.
December 9, 2014 5:14 p.m.
I dont think voice of resurgence is good in a rock shell. You could make it decent by running a much more aggressive version of the deck, but that would be diluting the theme too much IMO.
December 9, 2014 5:15 p.m.
No. It doesn't have to eat a bolt - they ignore it and fly over you. It does nothing until it's a real threat. It will never reach this stage in rock.
December 9, 2014 5:21 p.m.
lemmingllama says... #5
I wasn't saying it was good, just that they cannot cast things at instant speed without filling the board with tokens. Still, its not really the point of the deck, its more of a goodstuff addition.
December 9, 2014 5:41 p.m.
Voice of Resurgence is laughable compared to Tarmogoyf when we talk about "goodstuff"... I don't want to jump on the bandwagon but: Voice has no place in a Rock-Shell. It's no threat, it's a stupid 2/2 beater they can ignore, not enough pressure, yada yada yada.
I think there's not much room for discussion what the "go-to-abzan-list" shoud look like:
24 Lands (8 Fetch, 3 Tec-Edge, 5 Shock, 2-3 Basic, 3-4 Manland, 1 Filter, 1 Urborg)8 Discard (4 TS, 3 Inqui, 1 Duress)14 Creatures (4 Goyf, 4 Scooze, 4 Rhino, 2 Anafenza/Courser/Fulminator)1 Souls4 Liliana (maybe 3/1 Sorin)9 killspells (4 Decay, 2 Dismember, 1 Path/ Pact/ Pulse/ Darkblast/ Disfigure)
There's really not much room for experiments. The list has proven it's resiliency and efficiency. I was just wondering if maybe playing Jund would be better to be better positioned against Pod. But the consesus is: Abzan > Jund in pretty much every other match-up.
December 9, 2014 5:49 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #7
When DRS was banned I tried to fill the void by using Voice of Resurgence and Noble Hierarch. Still capable of T2 Lilly's and the Voice token actually fits the economy theme of the deck quite well. ...obviously this hasn't been updated to the current meta but the shell is still there.
...In other news... Am I the only one who thinks that with A) Bobby on the sidelines & B) Siege Rhino being successfully played that MBD could actually be a thing in Modern? Removal Abrupt Decay check. Phyrexian Obliterator > Siege Rhino check. Access to all the disruption available. Thoughtseize Inquisition of Kozilek Liliana of the Veil check. Answers for Treasure Cruise and Snapcaster Mage in Bojuka Bog check. Our win-con Gary, Merchant of Asphodel check. ...manlands for control. Mutavault all day check. Pack Rat as our economy beat stick, dump for dead draws and devotion factory check. Throw in some Bloodghast for resilience & devotion...
December 9, 2014 5:59 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #8
I can see there's an innovative mind at work here. :) I can tell you pay close attention to tournament results.
But actually though, it's great to try things but sometimes what's stock is what works.
December 9, 2014 6 p.m.
If anyone's still interested in this - White Rock this is the list I will be playing in a small tournament on Saturday. It will be the last test for a PPTQ held on 27/28th Dec (in addition, the first place winner receives all 10 Fetchlands).
For the more unusual cards: Sorin, Solemn Visitor - I wanted to try one out. Someone mentioned it in this thread and I gave it some thought. He's actually not that bad, allows you to favorably attack into opposing goyfs, rhinos, etc. Can protect itself and leaves behind a 2/2 flier in the worst case. Also I felt that always when I dropped my Timelys, the Burn-Players had their Skullcrack / Flames of the Blood Hand at the ready. So I wanted to try out something different. Basically you can either play Rest for the Weary or Feed the Clan. I will try out Feed the Clan, let them go EOT Boros Charm you and I go: In response, I gain 10. I want to play maindeck Anafenza. With Pod having a strong showing at the most recent GP in Mailand last weekend (1st and 2nd place) I think it's good to hedge against this match-up in particular. Also she's a good beater. Since we saw a copy of Affinity in the top8 I think it's fine to go up to 2 souls main and cut 1 Liliana. Not sure about that though.
I will let you know how it turned out, if you have any questions please ask :)
(I'm not looking for suggestions currently, I want to try the list as it is.)
December 16, 2014 7:38 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #10
Okay fellaz, rip this list a part.
Putrefy 8vomit ChiefBell GlistenerAgent anybody else.
December 17, 2014 2 p.m.
I mentioned playing Sorin and I've been using him. He outright won me games against the mirror and Delver didn't know what to do with my manlands blocking delver and gaining life. I bumped up to playing 2 sorin and 3 liliana.
lemmingllama says... #1
Probably the fact that it messes with Delver's game plan and has to eat a Lightning Bolt, then replaces itself. It wouldn't really help at all against other matchups.
December 9, 2014 5:10 p.m.