Does anyone like Torrent Elemental for modern?
Modern forum
Posted on Jan. 21, 2015, 5:15 p.m. by PValBlanc
This guy looked decent a couple days ago, what with the obvious cruise synergy, now it's more of a Whip of Erebos contender or a potential finisher for aggro. He's still pretty steep at five cmc. So I'm kind of unsure here. Do you think it's worth brewing around this guy (izzet aggro maybe?) or should I not bother?
GoldGhost012 says... #3
Nah, I wouldn't bother. He's rather expensive and slow, especially since he doesn't have haste, his attacking ability isn't very good against really aggro or control since they're either not going to be untapped (aggro) or they won't have many creatures if any (control), and his ability is sorcery speed.
Generally in aggro deck you wouldn't have cards that cost 5 mana unless it's a big finisher like Thundermaw Hellkite. Especially if they don't have haste or impact the board as soon as they arrive.
January 21, 2015 5:22 p.m.
omnipotato says... #4
Hold your horses, Torrent Elemental may not even be good enough for Standard, let alone modern. Waayyy too slow for modern.
January 21, 2015 5:25 p.m.
It's funny because he doesn't actually die to removal. He laughs at Path to Exile, Abrupt Decay, and Lightning Bolt. For those reasons alone I'd stick him in a control deck just for some laughs.
January 21, 2015 5:33 p.m.
ChiefBell I hope you're trolling fine sir. Anything can be taken out one way or another. If not outright removal, Encrust or Claustrophobia will do fine. I cringe every time the words dies to removal show up anywhere.
That said, the point is taken. I should learn to trust my feelings when I see a card and think: close but no. Thank y'all.
January 21, 2015 5:44 p.m.
@PValBlanc, the chief wasn't trolling, he was talking about removal pertaining to the conversation. Encrust and Claustrophobia are completely unplayable in modern.
January 21, 2015 5:56 p.m.
Uhhh no one plays encrust or claustrophobia like ever. Dies to removal is actually a key concept that so many people misunderstand. The key thing to remember is that if your 1 drop creature dies to 1 mana removal then you're fine. If you're 5 mana creature dies to one mana removal then you've given your opponent a mini Time Walk. A chance to even up the board for some amount of mana and the respond with whatever they have left. It's a big tempo issue and is probably why so many people don't get why goyf is like $200 (it's because all the removal that kills him costs the same or more so he's always efficient).
January 21, 2015 5:59 p.m.
You make a point there. Apologies. Its just something I hear to trash absolutely anything in human existence. I seem to have developped a tendancy to overreact to that. For instance. I've seen people argue that bolt kills delver. Of course bolt kills delver. Did delver still top 8 regularly lately? Absolutely.
January 21, 2015 6:15 p.m.
ChiefBell has a point, of the removal that's widely played in Modern, Torrent Elemental dodges most of it. There isn't a lot of burn that hits it, and not even Path to Exile keeps it gone if you have access to 
mana.
That said, I think it's too expensive. Maybe if a Sultai or 
control deck shows up, but there isn't really a fit for him. Especially since Dig Through Time
+
Treasure Cruise
are banned.
January 21, 2015 6:19 p.m.
Well removal doesn't kill aggro in general because it swarms the board. Also delver costs the same as bolt - that's how they get around it. They barely lose any tempo from it.
January 21, 2015 6:32 p.m.
Agreed. Seriously, apologies for the arrogant reply.
January 21, 2015 6:37 p.m.
Its cool. I'm not angry or anything I just like to explain to people why 'dies to removal' is actually an important argument.
January 21, 2015 6:39 p.m.
ChiefWannaHacka says... #14
ChiefBell Coming in hot, keeping GBx #1 in our hearts and on the forums!
January 21, 2015 6:43 p.m.
omnipotato says... #15
Even though it can come back, the tempo loss from a Path to Exile on your Torrent Elemental is staggering.
I can maybe see it in a slower Standard delve/Whip build but not in modern.
January 21, 2015 7:08 p.m.
TristanTaylorsVoice says... #16
I just don't see a current deck it would fit into, particularly because without cruise there's no reason to play blue in B/G jund decks. Tapping all creatures isn't that impressive in modern, and if control mirrors became really popular for some hypothetical reason you might as well play AEtherling. I actually like Tasigur, the Golden Fang in B/G/x decks: he dodges Lightning Bolt and Abrupt Decay with Siege Rhino blocking stats that can recoup advantage from the yard in a deck filled entirely with good cards. They're already cutting Dark Confidant, I still don't really like bob in modern anyway so why not.
January 21, 2015 7:43 p.m.
Well, Dark Confidant got a bit better with Delver not taking up such a large share of the metagame. Now every red deck won't be running Forked Bolt and every 
deck won't be running Electrolyze. That makes Bob slightly better, not by much, but a bit.
January 21, 2015 7:50 p.m.
TristanTaylorsVoice says... #18
This is true, it's just in modern bob's life loss is the highest liability in all the formats he's legal. I'd rather just stick to Tarmogoyf as a road block, holding up Abrupt Decay and relying on something like Courser of Kruphix to draw cards instead. I don't see jund as an aggressive variant anymore, particularly without good one drops and the speed of Deathrite Shaman.
quesobueno123 says... #2
Not in modern. It just does not make sense, what deck does it go in? If it just is brewed around, you end up with a 300 dollar bad deck.
January 21, 2015 5:17 p.m.