Inquisition or Duress
Modern forum
Posted on Sept. 4, 2013, 5:48 p.m. by HarbingerJK
With Thoughtseize being reprinted I was wondering what people preffered in their decks...excluding Thoughtseize . Would you rather run Inquisition of Kozilek or Duress ? The answer: "I'll run 4 of both in mono black" doesn't count lol
MindAblaze says... #3
In a world where the dominant view is "you don't run cards with CMC >4" Inquisition looks a lot better. But if you struggle with some card types more than others (say you're playing Grixis) Duress will probably do the job.
September 4, 2013 5:55 p.m.
HarbingerJK says... #4
yeah Duress is quite limited. I guess the only plus for it is that it's a common lol
September 4, 2013 6:36 p.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #5
Inquisition is the the correct call here, it can pick off a ton of threats in modern that duress wiffs.
September 4, 2013 7:07 p.m.
Inquisition of Kozilek always trumps all the other discard spells. (Except Hymn to Tourach and Thoughtseize usually)
September 4, 2013 8:15 p.m.
It depends, iok for modern, duress for legacy, where you're either doing combo destruction or protection and normally a spell is fine.
September 4, 2013 9:46 p.m.
Wow. I saw the title to this thread and thought it was a great topic, but I'm really surprised by the one-sidedness of the answers.
While this isn't universal, discard is brought in primarily to fight combo or some sort of strategy like Tron where hitting one piece of many can really hurt it. While Inquisition of Kozilek wins against a whole lot of small creatures in this format, you don't even normally want discard in against a deck like that (trading one-for-one against those decks at a tempo loss is not a winning formula). In the decks where you do bring in discard, you want to be able to hit Splinter Twin and Scapeshift and Karn Liberated too.
So I can very much see having IoK in the main because at least you might get some value out of it against decks that you will probably want to board it out against in game two. Duress is a much better sideboard card.
September 6, 2013 9:04 a.m.
Thats the conclusion Ive come to. Generally, here is more things you can snatch with inquisition, but there comes a time where duress is needed. Good side board card.
September 6, 2013 1:45 p.m.
HarbingerJK says... #11
I pretty much assumed that people would go with Inquisition, just because it gives you way more options in modern. Duress isn't bad, but it ain't no Thoughtseize
September 6, 2013 6:28 p.m.
Well, unfortunately, IoK is also no Thoughtseize . The assumption is that IoK is better because Modern is a quick format, but it's not a quick format only because it plays little guys. For being a card that's supposed to counteract combo, it fails pretty miserably against Scapeshift, Splinter Twin, and to some extent Tron (which isn't really combo, but which you sort of have to play against like it is, because you can't afford to allow them to get permanents into play).
I did play two IoK and two Duress in my sideboard until recently, and I almost never wanted to bring IoK in. Again, it's better in the main because it's better against an unknown deck, but after sideboarding...well, I wish I'd have gone with 4 Duress rather than my 2-2 split. Maybe a 3-1 split. Doesn't matter now, since I went and got the Seizes 10 days before they were spoiled in Theros.
Sadly, the conclusion I came to after playing those cards is that if you want to play serious, competitive Modern, you're going to have to splurge at some point on Thoughtseize . There are alternatives, but nothing replaces its sheer power.
September 9, 2013 9:18 a.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #13
Man, I don't know about that. Inquisition of Kozilek really hits a lot of the good stuff as well. Remember that Duress cannot hit Dark Confidant , Tarmogoyf or Snapcaster Mage . But IoK can hit all of them and also ditch Deceiver Exarch , Voice of Resurgence , Viscera Seer , Knight of the Reliquary and Melira, Sylvok Outcast into the yard. It also clips every common counter except Cryptic Command . IoK just hits more problem cards while still disrupting most of the same things, I mean, sure, it doesn't ditch Gifts Ungiven or Scapeshift but that's why decks run Thoughtseize too.
September 9, 2013 9:07 p.m.
The problem is that the cards you talk about that Inquisition of Kozilek hits naturally cost three mana or less. Most of them that you mention cost two. Which means that if you're on the draw, you have to play IoK on the first turn to make it useful in the least. Draw it on turn two or later and it's a dead card. Anything that the opponent topdecks after the first turn or two becomes utterly immune to your discard spell. While all discard spells are this way, at least the others can hit bigger combo pieces and therefore remain relevant after turn two.
This is why when I'm playing against GBx (the home of Tarmogoyf and Dark Confidant ), I'm boarding discard spells out after game one, especially if I'm on the draw. Well, part of the reason. The other part is that even if you make him discard his entire hand, his topdecks are probably miles better than yours, and topdecks aren't affected by discard spells anyway. Either way, the deck against which your IoK would have the best targets is the same deck that you don't want discard spells against.
Which is why IoK is okay in game one. When you don't know what your opponent is playing, you can at least be confident of getting something useful in the first couple of turns, even if you then immediately want to take all of the discard out of your deck. If you must play game one discard and can't do Thoughtseize , I still agree that IoK is the way to go. But it's a very narrow sideboard card.
Epochalyptik says... #2
Inquisition of Kozilek is the other go-to discard spell. Duress is good, but Inquisition of Kozilek hits an enormous number of the threats in Modern. The inability of Duress to hit creatures limits it in several matchups.
September 4, 2013 5:53 p.m.