Is Discard viable in Modern?
Modern forum
Posted on March 25, 2013, 1:12 a.m. by Bauhom
I'm working on my first ever Modern deck, and I'm looking at converting my Standard format discard deck to a Modern one. I've found a lot of good cards for it but I'm not sure how good it'll be if it depends on games going on for awhile (using cards like The Rack , Shrieking Affliction , and Liliana's Caress ). I know Modern games tend to end quickly, so ... I don't know.
Bummer. Thanks very much for the answer. I wish I hadn't just invested in all those cards ...
I do have cards like Inquisition of Kozilek Duress Despise Distress . Do you think those would be useful? With some quick discarding I was hoping I could disrupt their early game enough to make things interesting.
March 25, 2013 3:23 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
Inquisition of Kozilek and Thoughtseize are by far the best discard spells in Modern (and two of the best discard spells ever printed). However, I wouldn't build a whole deck around them. They see the most play in Jund, which leverages some discard control to fuel Deathrite Shaman and Tarmogoyf .
Discard as a primary or especially as a sole strategy is not very effective in any format, unfortunately. You could still build a pretty interesting casual deck with those cards, but I don't recommend going competitive with it.
March 25, 2013 3:30 a.m.
Yeah I was looking at Thoughtseize earlier and I was definitely going to get it until I checked the pricetag. Yeah.
I put together a Standard format discard deck that's playing well for me so far, but I don't know how it would play against top tier decks. It holds up fine against my best Rakdos aggro deck. Shrieking Discard Mono-Black
March 25, 2013 3:36 a.m.
Mind Funeral . It's viable just not advisable. You will annoy the shit out of people which is always fun. If your looking to clean house at FNM you probably want to go a different route, unless your local shop isnt very good.
March 25, 2013 8:40 a.m.
Hypnotic Specter along with the Dimir stuff in standard with Liliana's Caress and whatnot might be alright.
March 25, 2013 8:45 a.m.
incredibruhahaha says... #8
Hi buddy, I play discard, I think I can help you out ;)
The issue with discard is pretty much that people believe they can neutralize their opponent's strategy during the first turns. Discarding doesn't work that way.
The game is designed in such way that any player can play an average of five to seven cards out of the eleven you have by turn four, counting mana. No matter what. The problem is that during these turns, you can't make him discard to a point where his strategy is affected. If you're lucky, by turn three you've gotten three discards in, give or take an 1/1 or enchantment. In modern, that means you've had mean love made to you.
If you can broaden your mind to other mechanics, however, you can pull it off.
Blue/White control, i.e. works wonders with discarding, by slowing down the game. A deffensive Affinity does too, through Ratchet Bomb , Spellskite , etc. Another way is looking for a cool combo you can pull off by turn 4. something that either locks the table or empties it, so you can start burning with the likes of The Rack or Quest for the Nihil Stone . The last option is aggro: Nyxathid .
As of right now, there's this funny deck Tuo Deppat I made to experiment with the possibilities of combo discarding. You may want to take a look at it.
Cheers
March 25, 2013 5:28 p.m.
Hey, incredibru! Thanks very much. When you say Blue/White control, do you mean Black/Blue/White (that's Esper, right?)? Any non-standard Modern cards off the top of your head that are good for that (I'm only familiar with standard cards).
Right now (in Modern) I've been playing with either a mono-black control (including Mutilate and Black Sun's Zenith for now--Damnation is too pricey) that's heavy on discard and the punishers I mentioned in the original question or a mono-black discard that has some aggro. My standard discard/aggro deck uses some Desecration Demon to survive the mutilates. In case you might have any thoughts on that one, it's Shrieking Discard Mono-Black.
Thanks again!
March 26, 2013 6:53 p.m.
Not to be rude to anyone else but don't look up deck that are doing good it's more fun to find your own combos. Also you can do a lot with discard. The Rack can stack and be doing 6 damage by turn 2 throw in some Quest for the Nihil Stone and you can win turn 4 so no I think discard is awesome. I shut out my friends myr affinity deck and you don't drop your hand faster then that. It's more fun to me to beat these kids storm and zoo decks they looked up because you know what to expect but they will have a hard time with you're deck cuz no one side bars for discard and usually just expect to see the same decks. I say build it. No one deck strategy is unbeatable remember that
June 19, 2013 2:26 p.m.
Not to be rude to anyone else but don't look up deck that are doing good it's more fun to find your own combos. Also you can do a lot with discard. The Rack can stack and be doing 6 damage by turn 2 throw in some Quest for the Nihil Stone and you can win turn 4 so no I think discard is awesome. I shut out my friends myr affinity deck and you don't drop your hand faster then that. It's more fun to me to beat these kids storm and zoo decks they looked up because you know what to expect but they will have a hard time with you're deck cuz no one side bars for discard and usually just expect to see the same decks. I say build it. No one deck strategy is unbeatable remember that. Also don't forget the summer of black. That's when I started playing. Also if you do go discard think about a red splash for direct damage or blue for draw so you're not top carding too
June 19, 2013 2:28 p.m.
I've found that pure discard in modern really doesn't develop your board state without a backbone to go off of. Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek are great cards but usually limited to power plays on early turns. Conversely, Liliana of the Veil is a lot of more powerful later on in the game as you can use it to affect the board state and even more gives decks like Jund the top deck it needs. I personally like cards like Smallpox in conjunction with graveyard recursion; I do think the classic The Rack and similarly Shrieking Affliction is kind of unpowered now usually because of common side boards like Obstinate Baloth or his standard version Loxodon Smiter .
If you would like you can check out my B/G Pox deck for modern; Box Wine which runs a lot of these ideas being discussed here. It's been doing quite well at my local store tournaments.
June 20, 2013 12:34 p.m.
hiddengibbons says... #13
without Mind Twist and Hymn to Tourach , discard will probably never be as good as it was.
June 21, 2013 5:21 p.m.
Making a deck around discard: No
Putting some discard in a deck: Yes
Epochalyptik says... #2
Short answer: no.
Long answer: Modern is a fast format that doesn't really get hurt by slow discard engines. Cards like The Rack and Liliana's Caress are no good when your opponent is dropping most of his or her hand within the first few turns - before your discard spells and permanents even begin to make much of an impact. You'll be mauled by zoo and aggro before long.
My advice is to look at the recent Top-8 reports for Modern events and see what's doing well. While discard is too slow, you might get an idea for what else could work.
March 25, 2013 1:55 a.m.