Is leyline of thw void worth playing?
Modern forum
Posted on April 17, 2015, 11:58 p.m. by Barry_McKawkinner
Im expecting control to be a problem.Would leyline of the void help me?
Barry_McKawkinner says... #3
Im playing abzan agro.Im expecting bug and twin.
April 18, 2015 12:11 a.m.
Leyline of the void definitely isn't good against control. The only deck it's worth playing in is legacy and vintage dredge for the mirror match.
April 18, 2015 12:12 a.m.
Just assuming you are using the Abzan build on your page. Rest in Peace would probably be a better option.
other than Snapcaster Mage and Storm, you really don't have to worry too much about graveyards in modern as far as I know. and frankly, It's not worth removing the graveyard to deal with snapcaster.
April 18, 2015 12:14 a.m.
I've actually seen a number of dredge decks with Golgari Grave-Troll and/or Unburial Rites, as well as the occasional Vengevine deck. And Gifts Ungiven is a thing too. So graveyard hate is decent. But having said that, Rest in Peace is stronger for your deck.
April 18, 2015 12:20 a.m.
These graveyard decks DO exist. However they're not good, not at all. Don't dedicate sideboard slots to decks that aren't prevalent and aren't a threat. Modern is a format where your sideboard is way more important than any other format. Use those slots for more relevant decks.
April 18, 2015 12:22 a.m.
Playing WBG gives you access to massive graveyard removal options. but as I said, graveyard removal isn't necessary in modern. the few decks it effects are negligible at best. there are a multitude of ways to beat Twin, namely Torpor Orb and enchanment exile/tuck such as Deglamer or Unravel the Aether (so you can get rid of Keranos, God of Storms as well).
If I knew the BUG architype I could help you further there.
April 18, 2015 12:23 a.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #9
Rest in peace hurts me because i run knight of the reliquary.I also have to worry about tarmogoys.
April 18, 2015 1:03 a.m.
Screw RiP, just run 2-3 Scavenging Ooze in the 75 cards and you'll do fine.
April 18, 2015 2:10 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #12
What vishnarg said.
And your argument for not playing RIP is stupid. Who cares if your Goyfs are small, or KotR is a 2/2, because you literally just win the matchups where you need RIP.
April 18, 2015 2:25 a.m.
Hey. Guy who only plays abzan here.
You should run graveyard hate. The reason is that abzan loses to graveyard based combo decks full stop. They make your removal useless because obviously you can't just 1-for-1 them. And scavenging ooze isn't enough to stop them because you're not likely to draw into them. Examples of decks where you're going to have problems are dredge, re animator and gifts. All of which are fringe but they ARE seen.
You should be running Grafdigger's Cage. It doesn't hurt your tarmogoyfs and scavenging oozes - Rest in Peace does. Furthermore re animator can go off on T2 before you've had the chance to play Rest in Peace
April 18, 2015 6:24 a.m.
In your case you have even bigger problems because they can put infinite pressure on your creatures by repeatedly bringing their threats back.
Yes it does matter if your win conditions are ruined, by the way. It makes the match completely unsustainable because you lose your aggressive edge.
April 18, 2015 6:28 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #17
ChiefBell What I was talking about was graveyard decks specifically, like Dredge, Omnarscience (god forbid people actually play it) and Storm. You want to make them lose more than you need that Goyf to work.
April 18, 2015 7:16 a.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #18
I think you misunderstood me.I need to stop their tarmo goyf and snapcaster without hurting my creatures.Graveyard hate isnt gunna shut their deck down completely.
April 18, 2015 7:43 a.m.
lemmingllama says... #19
I agree with ChiefBell, you should be running Grafdigger's Cage. It won't help against their Tarmogoyfs, but it will turn off all their flashback spells and Snapcaster Mages. If you are worried about Tarmogoyf, simply run some copies of Deathmark or Dismember in your sideboard to kill them.
April 18, 2015 7:51 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #21
Ok, so you don't need to stop Dredge, Storm and Griselcannon style decks? Then you don't need RIP.
Grafdigger's Cage beats Snappy and sometimes stops random things. If you're playing Little Kid Abzan, you don't really need to worry that much about Goyf, because your entire deck was made to beat midrange Abzan. Maybe a Dismember would help, but it's a matchup that you shouldn't really be struggling with.
April 18, 2015 9:44 a.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #22
Im not worried about abzan.I need to beat Sultia.A really good one
April 18, 2015 10:16 a.m.
Scavenging ooze will fight their snapcaster mages and can try to keep their tarmogoyfs under control
April 18, 2015 10:32 a.m.
You also need to move your smiters to the mainboard, that card is nuts. Especially against GB/x decks like BUG
April 18, 2015 10:33 a.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #25
My original thought was Grafdigger's Cage. However Relic of Progenitus and Bojuka Bog could work.
April 18, 2015 11:04 a.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #26
Well you could vastly improve your control match up by running 4x Treetop Village having some Thrun, the Last Troll to side in would be good too.
Really though Twin & Control should be matches in your favor already...
April 18, 2015 11:16 a.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #27
I like bojuka bog and thrun.Im going to pick those up today.Ive been thinkin about either stirring wildwood or treetop id only need one cuz i run kotr and I can just go get them.I should have a good matchup but ive only been playing for 6 months so its harder to compete with players who have been at it for years.
April 18, 2015 12:30 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ Twin is one of this decks worst matchups. That's why everyone stopped playing the deck after the pro tour.
April 18, 2015 12:42 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #29
How so? I imagine Decay, Path and Voice make you rather favored.
April 18, 2015 12:48 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #30
I tweaked the deck a little to give me a chance at beatin twin and amulet.Thats all I want is just a chance.Ive come close but since Im still new i made crucial miss plays that cost me the match.
April 18, 2015 12:55 p.m.
The majority of lists run like 4 paths in the mainboard and that's their only removal. After sideboard they get to bring in some more hate but just lose to blood moon and anger of the gods.
April 18, 2015 2:13 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #32
That makes sense. It's a pretty easy fix, though: Trim top-enders for Decay if Twin presents a serious enough problem in your metagame.
April 18, 2015 2:14 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #33
I main 1decay and 2 pridemage.Board 1 decay 2 natures claim and 2 memorcide for combo decks.Do you think cutting a ligering souls for another decay would work
April 18, 2015 2:23 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #34
I didn't realize you were only running 3 Thoughtseize ...
/x when built properly has a good matchup vs Twin. (Is a more accurate way of what I was trying to say) 4x AD & 7-8 Thoughtseize
I'd run 1x Stirring Wildwood and 2-3 Treetop Village although relying on Knight of the Reliquary to fetch everything when you need it is not advised.
April 18, 2015 2:36 p.m.
Abzan midrange has a good twin matchup. This is little kid abzan. The list that top 8'd the pro tour played 4 paths main and 2 thoughtseize and then boarded in 2 more thoughtseize. Played no decays in the 75.
April 18, 2015 2:40 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #36
Im not playing green black.I play green white.
April 18, 2015 2:40 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #37
Id still advise 7-8 discard spells. They'll help vs both Twin & Control without having to waste SB space for matches you should already have in the bag.
April 18, 2015 5:47 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #39
Oh well :/ I like the control deck better. Just nudging in the right direction.
April 18, 2015 5:57 p.m.
Different deck. Little kid abzan absolutely destroys the midrange variants. Which is better is just a meta call.
April 18, 2015 6:14 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #42
I run 4 thoughtsize and 2 memoricide.I dont have room for anymor hand disruption.The deck is really tight on space i have trouble putting 1 card in it.I have plenty of combo hate in my board.If i take anything else out id have a hard time dealing with the other decks.
April 18, 2015 7:01 p.m.
Dont make it into a control deck. It's not one. It doesn't want to be one. Youre going to struggle against combo, but that's the nature of the beast - you can't ace every matchup.
April 18, 2015 7:03 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #44
Im not but combo is really big in my local meta so i have to give myself a chance.
April 18, 2015 7:20 p.m.
Well then unfortunately you're going to struggle. My deck plays up to 15 pieces of removal spells and other bits of interaction and can occasionally struggle. Your deck can't even get close to that number - it would take almost all of your SB.
The problem is that whilst little kid abzan/junk is great against the control version, it's really poor against twin and other combo decks. If little kid junk gets popular then twin decks will start to come into force because twin can beat it easily. Thats how the meta works. A deck gets really good and then decks that can beat it easily become more popular to compensate. Thats kind of the nature of modern.
April 18, 2015 7:26 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #46
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=9525&d=254690&f=MO
Call me crazy but I think this deck would be better with Selesnya Charm over the black splash.
What do I know.. I prefer Abrupt Decay over Qasali Pridemage ...I'm sure the reasoning for the voice token count.
April 18, 2015 7:29 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #47
Seems Tron would stomp this as well? (Anybody played the match up?)
April 18, 2015 7:31 p.m.
Barry_McKawkinner says... #48
I have enough cards to give me a chance against combo.tron doesn't exist out here and if I so come across it i got enough artifact hate to give me a chance
April 18, 2015 8 p.m.
You cant hate on tron. It plays planeswalkers and artifacts that leave more artifacts when they die. The only way to hate on tron is by destroying their land.
April 18, 2015 8:02 p.m.
You cant be like 'Oh I'll just destroy some artifacts and it'll be ok!'
GoofyFoot says... #2
This question is way too vague. What deck are you running? What control decks do you expect?
There are a plethora of graveyard removal options, and they all depend on what deck you are running.
April 18, 2015 12:09 a.m.