Is Mardu viable in competitive modern?
Modern forum
Posted on Dec. 12, 2014, 4:36 a.m. by NimbleSlothMTG
I've been working on a Modern Mardu Midrange deck somewhat taking some influence from its Standard counterpart.
Butcher of the Horde seems like a fine threat for Modern, Olivia Voldaren often sees play in Jund and I personally feel this card is all round better. The deck is somewhat similar to Junk in how it plays, and is similar in card pool having access to cards like Lingering Souls, Inquisition of Kozilek, Thoughtseize, expect it has access to red and white allowing you to play things like Lightning Bolt and Lightning Helix, cards like Brimaz, King of Oreskos and Lingering Souls provide tokens for Butcher to sacrifice, there are a few things I'm stuck on though:
Is Dark Confidant worth playing right now, especially considering I have 3 Butcher of the Horde in the deck, or are there better sources of card advantage?
Is Crackling Doom worth playing as a 1-2 of mainboard to answer cards like Geist of Saint Traft, Thrun, the Last Troll and Etched Champion?
How many discard spells should I play, due to Dig Through Time and Treasure Cruise seeing so much play?
Are there any decent aggressive 2-drop threats that are worth playing, or am I better trying to play more of a control strategy early on in the game?
Is Liliana of the Veil worth running as a 3-4 of or would other planeswalkers such as Ajani Vengeant, Chandra, Pyromaster, Elspeth, Knight-Errant even Sorin, Solemn Visitor be better?
Is Butcher of the Horde a threat worth playing or should I run something like Baneslayer Angel or Blood Baron of Vizkopa?
Is something like Bitterblossom worth playing to provide an almost constant source of tokens for Butcher of the Horde?
NimbleSlothMTG says... #3
Thanks a lot for the input
Is there anything you'd recommend over Dark Confidant, Phyrexian Arena seems fine if I have access to life gain as does Night's Whisper, though I feel Arena seems much more worth while as it's difficult to removal and pretty much does the same as Confidant without as much life being loss.
I was thinking that myself, though having an instant speed answer that also burns for 2 seems like it could be worth while.
Makes sense.
Only two drop that comes to my mind is Young Pyromancer, but I'm not quite sure if that's what this deck really needs.
Completely agree I was playing with the idea of 3 myself and found it to be decent enough, Chandra, Pyromaster and Ajani Vengeant both seem worth while also if I go into a more of a control deck and Sorin, Solemn Visitor was a thought if I decide to go more into an aggressive take on the deck.
Stormbreath Dragon was a card I was considering but I personally feel Baneslayer Angel and Blood Baron of Vizkopa are a lot better, the lifelink is super relevant, Baneslayer is insanely difficult to answer in combat, where as Blood Baron is large enough to dodge most red removal spell aside from Combust and Flame Slash, unless the opponent plays 2 for 1 to remove it. And pro white and black solves most other removal spells, I think the only way he can often die is in combat against something like Tarmogoyf, if the opponent has a sweeper or edict effect, or if they're playing Vapor Snag.
7.As for Bitterblossom, is not worth while if it means having a constant source allowing Butcher to sacrifice to gain lifelink to make the lifeloss irrelevant, or is it simply not worth it due to the Butcher being easy enough to remove?
December 12, 2014 6:24 a.m.
NimbleSlothMTG says... #4
Here's a list of all of the cards I've been considering, I feel each one has a good argument about why you should play it.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/mardu-choices-for-modern/
December 12, 2014 6:26 a.m.
Sorry I'm on my mobile so I can't be too responsive.
You have access to Night's Whisper which is ok. Phyrexian arena only draws you a single card by t4. If you're playing control then that's ok because you can protect it but if not it's too slow.
Regarding crackling doom - 3 mana for something that removes a single target just isn't good enough in this meta.
I would run a single blood baron and maybe two butcher. The problem with bitterblossom is that you want 4 because you want to guarantee you play it early but equally you don't want 4 because playing any more than 2 is super risky. Do you see the problem? In a deck with a lot of lifelink it may be ok. Have you considered batterskull though? It dodges all removal for 3 mana.
December 12, 2014 7:29 a.m.
Ohthenoises says... #6
I'm going to tag VampireArmy since he's our resident Mardu aficionado.
December 12, 2014 7:37 a.m.
VampireArmy says... #7
Oh boy looks like i'm a little late to the party.
reguarding Dark Confidant : The only safe way to run this card in this meta is to have :
A. Lots of ways to gain life (such as 4x Lightning Helix 3-4x Kor Firewalker)
B. A way to sacrifice him when it's time to get rid of him. Otherwise he will kill you.
Crackling Doom : it can really only be good against Tron/Boggles/infect. if your meta has those than Sideboard it. It's an instant speed answer
3 liliana of the veil is amazing in the build if you're doing midrange-control. She provides an amazing amount of pressure.
lastly yeah I MUST suggest having Kor Firewalker somewhere in this list as at least a 3 of. I've won soooooo many games with this card. He triggers off of your own spells most of the time even.
otherwise it seems you're undecided about what you want to be playing. you have a pile of goodstuff in the deck you linked. it's all a matter of choosing what suits to hate your meta best. It's kinda what mardu does best.
December 12, 2014 12:22 p.m.
NimbleSlothMTG says... #8
I've been testing an updated build and I have to agree with you VampireArmy Kor Firewalker has so far been insane, 4 Dark Confidant hasn't been too bad so far thanks to 2 Lightning Helix, 3 Kor Firewalker, 2 Butcher of the Horde (As a sacrifice outlet and for lifelink), and having 11 spells that all trigger Kor Firewalker. I don't think I'm going to bother with Crackling Doom even in the sideboard as sweeper effects like Volcanic Fallout, Anger of the Gods and Damnation/Wrath of God are just a tonne better especially the red sweepers with Kor Firewalker.
ChiefBell I like the idea of Blood Baron of Vizkopa but am unsure whether he's worth running, I think I'm going to test him out as he just seems insane if I can stick him to the board, though Batterskull may end up just being a little better, will definitely test them both though.
December 12, 2014 4:10 p.m.
Blood baron dodges Path to Exile, Lightning Bolt, Abrupt Decay, Slaughter Pact, Dismember and has lifelink.
Batterskull dodges no removal except Lightning Bolt unless you pay 3 mana. However vigilance AND lifelink is a lot better when you're on the defensive than just having lifelink on its own.
December 12, 2014 4:14 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #10
Well remember that the big Emrakul, the Aeons Torn provides them with an extra turn, (Or if reanimated has haste) so unless you are good with -15 life and -6 permanents.
Boggles has totem armor enchantments and fetches that grab Dryad Arbor so field wipes and forced sac doesn't work on them as much.
Infect is not so bad. Path to Exile does the trick just as well but it's nice to have
:P make a note of this!
December 12, 2014 4:16 p.m.
NimbleSlothMTG says... #11
Here's the list I've currently been playing around with for the past 2 hours.
So far I can definitely say:
Slaughter Games is just insane and is probably worth it as a 3 of, it's great against most of the combo decks out there. Great vs Scapeshift, Splinter Twin and Jeskai Ascendancy.
I've just added Crackling Doom over Anger of the Gods.
Volcanic Fallout seems a little better than Anger of the Gods as an uncounterable sweeper vs Delver.
Olivia Voldaren is a game-breaker against other midrange decks such as Junk, and is great against Mono U Tron (taking a Platinum Angel is great).
Kor Firewalker is just insane, Phyrexian Arena is fine against anything that isn't Delver, Burn or Affinity.
AndBrimaz, King of Oreskos needs to see waaayyy more play in Modern... the card is insane!
Here's the deck - Mardu Midrange
December 12, 2014 4:32 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #12
I actually tried slaughter games vs Scapeshift and never could draw it. let me know if it works out better for you. Scapeshift is life our silver bullet matchup. We almost stand 0 chance Game 1! i'm using Leyline of Sanctity myself but i'll be inclined to switch if it proves to be worse than slaughter
December 12, 2014 4:36 p.m.
I did. But it still makes it seem like a sideboard card. And argable a worse one than gets verdict.
December 12, 2014 4:46 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #17
Geth's verdict offers a choice, Doom doesn't. "Highest Power" is strictly better than "any creature"
December 12, 2014 4:48 p.m.
NimbleSlothMTG says... #18
I managed to beat Scapeshift after sideboarding, I sided in my 2 Slaughter Games, Relic of Progenitus, Rest in Peace and 2 Fulminator Mage, I guess I was pretty lucky game 2 I had a turn 1 Relic of Progenitus which helped keep my opponent off of Dig Through Time, turn 2 I played a Thoughtseize discarding the Scapeshift he had in his hand, turn 3 my Brimaz got countered by Remand, then turn 4 I managed to stick it, hoping to just start beating down with it and the Butcher I had just drawn, then turn 5 I drew into Slaughter Games which I played instantly calling Scapeshift and then game 3 my opponent opened with a hand with a 3 land, 1 Lightning Bolt, 1 Sakura-Tribe Elder (which I discarded with Inquisition turn 1), a Search for Tomorrow (which he played turn 1), and 1 Pyroclasm, I managed to go turn 1 Inquisition discarding his Tribe Elder, turn 2 Dark Confidant which my opponent removed with Bolt, turn 3 Brimaz, into turn 4 Butcher, sacking for haste, I won on turn 6 without him being able to deal me a single bit of damage xD
December 12, 2014 5:08 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #19
That's pretty boss dude. You're list might even be better than mine! XD i aint salty. It's probs beceause I have a pet card of Falkenrath Aristocrat that I use over butcher but I also own 2 butchers. I'll take it to the drawing board
December 12, 2014 5:12 p.m.
NimbleSlothMTG says... #20
VampireArmy have you seen the 5 colour "Aristocrats" list that's been popping up, it's a pretty sweet deck if you want to try and get max use out of Falkenrath Aristocrat. I've been wanting to play around with various Aristocrat builds in Modern as I loved the deck during INS-RTR block and would love for it to be competitively viable for Modern. But yeah thanks man, I've been wanting to try and make Mardu work for a while now but haven't quite been able to find a "formula" I like, I played around with a build using Pack Rat pre-KTK but after some testing realised it just wasn't that great this format, Rat's just a little too slow a threat and Dark Confidant is nowhere near as good as what it used to be, it's still not great in this deck, but if you can stick one and have it work out in your favour it's great, I'm tempted to replace it with Night's Whisper but it's a creature I can sack to Butcher of the Horde and the extra cards are nice. I have been removing it from the main altogether vs Delver, Burn and Affinity though. I'll probably write up some kind of deck primer-esque thing and sideboard guide in the description to the deck once I'm 90% guaranteed the list won't change (I'm always making changes to my lists xD)
December 12, 2014 5:51 p.m.
I'm late to the party, but Crackling Doom is perfect against Bogles. Totem armor doesn't protect against sac effects because the creature isn't "destroyed." Whether it's worth putting it in the side over WOG/Damnation depends on your meta though.
December 13, 2014 9:36 a.m.
VampireArmy says... #22
Actually i haven't been able to see a full list but from what I've seen, i wasn't impressed. Do you feel Thai butcher is better in midrange? I gotta say it's nice to speak to someone else who knows this deck like i do. (No offense intended to anyone else and i apologize in advance if any is taken)
December 13, 2014 4:43 p.m.
this is the most established mardu deck in Modern, I've ever seen in my life, hell I'll say most established deck in modern.
"I have a bad feeling about this." Playtest
Modern
SCORE: 163 | 7 COMMENTS | 15003 VIEWSDecember 13, 2014 11:05 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #24
Eh it's not really mardu.though. That's ss with black red splash.
December 13, 2014 11:09 p.m.
You can't deny it of it's properties and power level though! @VampireArmy
December 13, 2014 11:12 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #26
Of its a really good deck. I remember when i was bouncing ideas from that deck back when i was developing a boros.versionversion i think his was orignally boros too but i don't remember
ChiefBell says... #2
1) No
2) Not main board. Even sideboard Damnation over it.
3) 7 is pretty usual. Don't worry about delve cards ruining discard. Taking away their best card is worth it.
4) Can't think of any two drops. Unsure.
5) Liliana is repeatable removal. She's very strong, but gains less importance when you lack card draw (ie. not playing Dark Confidant). Many decks have taken her down to 3. Chandra is good. Ajani is STUPID in control decks.
6) He dodges Lightning Bolt, Abrupt Decay and Slaughter Pact but not Dismember or Path to Exile. I prefer Stormbreath Dragon for pro-white and haste. I wouldn't include 5 drops unless you were playing a super control deck.
7) This is not a friendly meta for bitter blossom. Life loss every turn is bad.
December 12, 2014 5:42 a.m.