Psychatog in modern?
Modern forum
Posted on Aug. 20, 2015, 9:45 a.m. by kbarnhart
I'm sure a lot of you people here remember how Psychatog used to be the BEST creature around. Yes, he is now no longer regarded as a badass due to being outclassed by a handful of creatures. But what if he was modern legal?
Since Psychatog is only legal in legacy and vintage which have much higher power levels I can certainly see why he sees no play, but how does he stack up in modern?
Can anybody brainstorm some deck ideas where he could fit in, or if he would even show up in decks at all if he was legal.
Please dont say he's no good because he dies to all removal because 90% of modern creatures do too.
I assume his instant discard would be his biggest use. I don't assume people would use him as a big beater like Tarmagoyf.
I imagine he could be pretty solid in a Grixis delve style of deck or maybe a reanimator style deck.
Reason for asking is he's honestly just a straight up thug and one day I hope he sees a reprint.
Thoughts?
I didn't mention Upheaval because I wanted to see what else people would do with him without always falling back on that old combo.
August 20, 2015 10:04 a.m.
reverendvile777 says... #5
Upheaval and artifact ramp is literally the only reason Psychatog was such a powerful card. It'd be pretty worthless in modern without those things, and if it had the things it needed to be good, Modern would be in chaos.
August 20, 2015 11:47 a.m.
selesvyaloverer8 says... #6
its too expensive and requires too much work to do anything in modern.
August 20, 2015 12:18 p.m.
electromancer says... #7
I think a comparison to Lotleth Troll is helpful here. In order for Psychatog to be relevant it would have to take advantage of the fact that you can discard ANY card as opposed to just creatures. Nothing comes to mind immediately, but Lotleth Troll's lack of brokenness suggests to me that a Psychatog modern deck wouldn't be creature-discard-centric.
August 20, 2015 2:28 p.m.
I would just like to point out that saying psychatog dies to all removal IS very relevant not every creature does and those are the successful creatures in modern. Goyf tasigur gurmag angler hooting mandrils etc dont die to bolt. Tasigur gurmag and mandrils dont die to abrupt decay. Very few things die to the shock from kholghans command and those that do die to every removal do things when they come in snapcaster mage or come down early on turn one and kill your opponent delver. So no it dies to all removal it wont be good.
August 20, 2015 3:01 p.m.
electromancer says... #10
I'm going to assume OP doesn't care for a bunch of "Psychatog sucks" comments. That's obvious and doesn't contribute to the discussion.
August 20, 2015 3:07 p.m.
electromancer How is giving our thoughts of how psychatog would fair in modern not contribute to the discussion?
August 20, 2015 3:41 p.m.
I'd probably try playing it with dredge, with no upheavel that seems like a reasonable way to stall the ground and build up for that one big attack.
I think delve cards line up poorly with him though.
August 20, 2015 4:32 p.m.
Does anybody care to brew up a "modern" deck with Psychatog in it? No other banned cards. I'm curious to see what people on here can come up with, it seems that far to often people on here are so narrow minded when it comes to the format. If it isn't goyf it's no good etc.... Anybody got a fresh idea?
August 20, 2015 4:46 p.m.
canterlotguardian says... #14
We aren't "narrow-minded". I for one despise the very existence of Goyf and wish it had never been printed, but even I will admit that Goyf is one of the most powerful cards in Modern due to the way that it can get very out of control for your opponent with no effort. Why? Because it grows just by the players playing the game naturally. No other card in Modern does that. (I say one of the most powerful because to me, it's always come down to Goyf, Path to Exile, or Abrupt Decay as to what is most powerful in Modern.)
August 20, 2015 4:55 p.m. Edited.
In order for Psychatog to make a dent in Modern, the mechanics that supported it (namely, Madness) would have to make a comeback. Modern is too fast and interactive for it to play the "Dr. Teeth" style deck that made it so potent in the past, so the way to get it to work would be to make it the engine of a value deck centered around discarding spells and either flashing them back at a discount (Lingering Souls) or casting them for cheap (think Fiery Temper, Circular Logic, etc.). It'd probably be a little tricky, and he'd likely never live up to his past standing, but he could at least be playable. I hate to say it, but Psychatog's rival in Odyssey block Standard (Wild Mongrel) and the QuietRoar deck (Quiet Speculation + Roar of the Wurm) are probably better suited to Modern.
August 20, 2015 5:06 p.m. Edited.
electromancer says... #16
@EmblemMan It would contribute to most discussions, but given what the OP has stated, I don't think it was the intent of this discussion. BTW, I completely agree that 2 toughness is total garbage on a creature with no haste, or immediate effect on the battlefield, but I think that's been stated enough times.
@kbarnhart Next time you post, it's probably better to be more explicit about your intent. That being said I think this discussion could have value since it's likely that a similar card may be printed in the future (maybe similar to what rothgar13 mentioned about Wild Mongrel).
Two uses I can think of:
-Take advantage of insane self mill (Hedron Crab double landfall = +3/+3)
-A target for Treasure Hunt type decks
August 20, 2015 7:53 p.m.
electromancer thats fair I would just like to say my main reason to post about the "dies to removal" debate is because I hate when people say that when its just wrong and since it was relevant to talking about psychatog I felt it was a relevant place to post that rant. You can brew with psychatog all you want but keep in mind that for it to be good in modern "dies to removal" is relevant. Past that brew all you want. I think it would be best in a deck with lots of spells Snapcaster Mage and delve cards but not too many because that would fight with the psychatog and lots of fetchlands.
August 20, 2015 8:14 p.m.
I think rothgar13 nailed it...you would also need Circular Logic. That was the main card which made Psychatog so insane. You'd also need something like Chrome Mox to churn him out a turn sooner, or have enough mana to respond to removal.
To really crank up the notch for Modern, you'd also need the Tranquil Thicket cycle to play with Life from the Loam and Gifts Ungiven.
The list I've had in mind for Modern Psychatog would be four color (no red) dredge-a-tog. In such a list, Psychatog wouldn't be your only win condition as you'd also have Unburial Rites and Lingering Souls. Life from the Loam and Raven's Crime could make short work of their hand to make sure the coast is clear for you to drop Psychatog.
August 20, 2015 10:24 p.m.
electromancer says... #19
sylvannos, for Tranquil Thicket we have Horizon Canopy (which probably much better). Given that's only one playset, not a cycle.
August 20, 2015 10:42 p.m.
@electromancer: The issue is that you can only play one Horizon Canopy a turn. What made Dredge-a-Tog so insane was that you could Life from the Loam back three Tranquil Thicket lands, pay three mana, dredge back Life from the Loam, Golgari Grave-Troll, and draw a card, versus Horizon Canopy allowing you to do only one of those once a turn.
Milling yourself for 9 and drawing a card (or dredging back a second Golgari Grave-Troll) meant Psychatog could easily kill someone once you untap after casting Gifts Ungiven because he's getting at least +6/+6 every turn.
August 20, 2015 10:56 p.m.
JexInfinite says... #21
In Ad Nauseam decks, he'd be pretty great, but just a worse version of the other kill.
August 21, 2015 3:44 a.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #22
Hey slovakattack... Curios. Would you play 'Tog in Gifts?
August 22, 2015 1:06 a.m.
He only sort of dies to bolt... Ditch 2 cards and he's fine. Just make sure they're cards that want to be ditched. I'm thinking 4C loam would be the best home for him, but I think there's no tempo-style deck to build with him in modern. There just aren't enough resources to spend on him.
August 22, 2015 1:21 a.m.
Upheaval, Reliquary Tower, lots of card drawing, protection spells, and go in for kill.
EpicFreddi says... #2
I could see him in a sultay delve deck with goyf and tasigur or Grixis Delve with Grim Lavamancer.
August 20, 2015 9:57 a.m.