What is this Modern deck doing, and why?
Modern forum
Posted on May 26, 2015, 5:40 a.m. by ChiefBell
Spoilers Show
It has Kitchen Finks in the sideboard but only 8 white mana sources. That's a close call.
May 26, 2015 5:46 a.m.
Well, four of those eight white sources are fetchable. Gosh, Chief, you're acting like this guy sucks at Magic or something.
May 26, 2015 5:49 a.m.
But my point is your statistical chance of drawing into enough of those sources is super low. 8 cards in 60, is 4 cards in 30, is 2 cards in 15, is 1.5 cards in 7. On average he'll have have to go through 15 cards to see 2 white sources.
May 26, 2015 5:51 a.m.
The above should say "1 card in 7.5", not "1.5 cards in 7". Small typo.
May 26, 2015 6:06 a.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #9
You're fetching Thassa to make your shit unblockable like you just took exlax, d-sphere-ing their creatures at instant speed and turning their lands to islands at instant speed with spreading seas. You're also turning Geist into a 4/4 with steel. I saw it put in work. It was actually quite entertaining.
I mean, there's a distinct advantage when no one has really played against your deck in a tournament setting.
May 26, 2015 7:20 a.m. Edited.
I don't see the big deal, he has removal/counters for "goyfs", and if Zur lands, Geist becomes insane.
He can fetch white sources with all of his fetchlands.
May 26, 2015 7:22 a.m.
pumpkinwavy says... #11
Zur the Enchanter seems mostly to find side deck silver bullets, so that's why there's not too much in the maindeck. And if you've attacked with zur to the point where you have no more enchantments left, then you're probably very ahead.
But there's only Path to Exile to clear the ground for Geist of Saint Traft. If you're gonna play a geist deck play more removal.
Maybe he didn't have the money for Thoughtseize?
May 26, 2015 7:24 a.m.
pumpkinwavy says... #13
Well, a cool, innovative strategy is actually doing well! I'm hoping this becomes more played.
May 26, 2015 7:33 a.m.
fluffybunnypants - Yes but if you're going with 4 Zur I would have liked to have seen the ability be capitalised on a bit more. You have crazy advantage there - use it. There are only 6/7 enchantments in the deck.
AG4W - He is not running enough white to fetch reliably. And playing Zur just so that Geist could maybe become bigger is super stupid. Cards the depend on other cards are a bad idea in top tier play. And thoughtseize is obligatory. It's far, far too powerful to not include if you're playing at a high level. Duress and Inquisition miss too many important things.
May 26, 2015 8:01 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #17
I think Zur the Enchanter is a excellent card to use. It avoids Lightning Bolt and Abrupt Decay, can block Vendilion Clique, Delver of Secrets Flip, Lingering Souls and Pestermite, and it attacking is like, drawing a card and playing it for free that hates on whatever deck you want.
Instead of Thassa, I would have preferred Aqueous Form, because scry, though I don't know how often one would be turning Thassa into a creature,
Personally, I think it could have done a much better in terms of tool-boxing. Instead of Spreading Seas, I would have liked to see things like Ghostly Prison, Sanctimony, Monastery Siege, Suppression Field, Bitterblossom, Brain Maggot, Daybreak Coronet, Curiosity, Nevermore, Porphyry Nodes, Athreos, God of Passage (fairly easy to activate his devotion) and Runed Halo.
However, I could also see that the reason for the plethora of Spreading Seas could have been because of how imperative it is to have something against Tron, Affinity man-lands, and Junk's fragile mana-base. Not too mention Zur, swinging, tutoring up Spreading Seas, potentially destroying Junk's play for the next for turns, AND gaining card advantage is quite powerful.
May 26, 2015 8:28 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #18
Actually, there's one problem I have with Zur the Enchanter: And that is having to rely on Zur to win the game. You first need to draw him, and then protect him long enough so that you have a significant board state hate against the opponent. Unlike Scapeshift or Twin which just protects till they win instantly, Zur the Enchanter takes many more turns to get working, which I think is a problem with it going competitive.
May 26, 2015 8:34 a.m.
So I read all the comments and formed some opinions and then got to Femme_Fatale's comment and now I feel like a noob. Lol
May 26, 2015 8:36 a.m.
Femme_Fatale says... #20
PlattBonnay, your thoughts on this? I know you've made this deck:
Technicolour Toolbox Playtest
Modern
SCORE: 86 | 2 COMMENTS | 5396 VIEWSAlso calling on Earthsfire since he created the deck that yours is based off of :D
May 26, 2015 8:40 a.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #21
Thassa scrys every turn without needing an attack anyway.
May 26, 2015 8:50 a.m.
Zur is remarkably hard to remove. The problem I have with him is simply - without enchantments that give him +X/+X he takes forever to close out a game.
May 26, 2015 9:22 a.m.
It's just an Esper control shell using Zur as the finisher. Seems perfectly reasonable to me, because he dodges all removal in the format and generates insane card advantage very quickly, much like Geist of Saint Traft.
May 26, 2015 9:54 a.m.
ModernCentralPublic says... #25
Great deck over all, very well put together and clearly a lot of thought was put into it. I give this guy props.
This has by far been the best modern metagame since moderns creation, huge variety and lacking any real oppression, virtually any deck can survive if built correctly and as long as it doesn't have intuitive flaws against the tier 1 decks.
Great job wizards, you have really outdone yourself!
May 26, 2015 11:05 a.m.
vishnarg - Kind of see this as midrange. If it was a control deck for real I'd be more impressed. I don't think it's a straightforward as just being a control shell with a Zur finisher. Geist signals midrange, and so does Tasigur. It's ever so slightly creature heavy I think for it to just be straight up control.
May 26, 2015 11:28 a.m.
ChiefBell, you're right, but this is about as close to straight control as you'll ever see in a professional modern setting these days. I commend the creativity and hope this could turn into something popular.
May 26, 2015 11:37 a.m.
Completely commend the creativity and love the deck overall BUT honestly if I was going to an SCG event I would at least use thoughtseize instead of duress (would help massively against Junk and Jund), I would tweak my manabase, and I would look a little harder at whether a full playset of a 4 mana legendary creature is the best idea.
There are small niggling problems I have with this that sort of offend me given the size of the event.
May 26, 2015 11:39 a.m.
Props to the guy who made this. It certainly adds a surprise factor, and your opponent is bound to make misplays against it since they most likely never would have encountered it before.
May 26, 2015 11:41 a.m.
Well if you have problems with it make a version of the deck yourself and fix it to how you think it should be played!
May 26, 2015 11:49 a.m.
ModernCentralPublic says... #32
I think duress is better honestly, especially in a deck that doesn't care what creatures you have like this one. Duress really should be used more.
Also, this deck clearly isn't bad. It has curve toppers, powerful creatures, and incredibly versatile control. Whether this deck is better than esper mentor is yet to be decided, but only a fool would write off such a clearly talented and hard working deck builder like this.
The mentor list seems more consistent but a lot easier to disrupt than this, that's my first impressions before testing it.
May 26, 2015 12:04 p.m.
This deck does care about creatures. Early aggression like Tarmogoyf, and later threats like Sigarda, Host of Herons, or Siege Rhino are issues here. Mostly any creature can be problematic. They can all race Zur so they'll win an aggressive fight, and they can all successfully block Geist, so they can win a defensive fight too. I realise that Zur CAN be unblock able and all these other things, but again - that is conditional. These large creatures are, a great deal of the time, going to be problematic. Duress can't do anything about them. Thoughtseize can.
Furthermore aggressive decks will be a problem and thoughtseize can hit things like Goblin Guide, whilst duress can't. This deck isn't running a ton of removal so it needs to make sure it can deal with creatures before they hit the board. Thoughtseize makes this possible. Life loss against aggro isn't ideal but it's better than being hit multiple times by a goblin.
Thoughtseize gives you options which is what you need in high level play to cope with the variety of threats thrown against you. To be unable to cope with those threats can be a death sentence. I honestly think it's lucky he didn't come up against something like Amulet Bloom etc. because whilst Duress can slow that deck down, only Thoughtseize can strip it of win conditions.
I like this deck overall and have often thought about running Zur. He's a complete powerhouse. But with the format turning towards more aggressive options and Path to Exile over Abrupt Decay you really do want to make sure you have maximum flexibility in all your control options - discard spells included.
May 26, 2015 12:14 p.m.
I agree that Thoughtseize should have been used over Duress.
May 26, 2015 12:19 p.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #35
I'd like to have Geist of Saint Traft removed for one/two Runed Halo and maybe Ghostly Prison. Thassa, God of the Sea doesn't seem like she does enough, and I think two wrath effects should be mainboard. Spell Pierce isn't very good in the main, and the deck needs the fourth Mana Leak. I could also see 2 Snapcaster Mages fitting here. Also, Dismember.
Oh, and for the lols, Vampiric Link. Gives Zur lifelink, or locks down an opposing Goyf.
May 26, 2015 12:26 p.m.
TheAnnihilator says... #36
Oh, wow. Just reread Zur and realized he only has 1 power. That's a problem.
May 26, 2015 12:29 p.m.
I think Ghostly Prison could find it's way into this deck.
May 26, 2015 12:39 p.m.
The problem with this deck is that against Abzan and Jund, their removal (Abrupt Decay) can't be used against Zur or Geist. So it's left to be used on whatever you tutor up with Zur instead. So by running these evasive threats you've dodged loads of removal - which is good. But then you're tutoring up enchantments that are hit by that same removal - not good.
May 26, 2015 12:44 p.m.
Yeah, it's a solid card - could just run Spellskite though?
However then the deck gets kind of elaborate in some ways.
May 26, 2015 12:50 p.m.
It cannot but it does more against a variety of decks. It's like generally more useful.
May 26, 2015 1:05 p.m.
PlattBonnay says... #43
It seems like a less all-in version of past Zur decks, and sticking to just 3 colours makes it more consistent, allowing it to be more disruptive. However the trade off for this consistency is that it loses possible explosiveness, which is a bit of a downside because sometimes T2 GoST, T3 Steel is just good enough to win the game.
May 26, 2015 2:27 p.m.
Serendipitous_Hummingbird says... #44
I reject this deck. The only fetchable enchantment deck that I will recognize is Enduring Ideal
May 26, 2015 3:15 p.m.
NotSoLuckyLydia says... #45
This deck seems like the most mediocre version of the Zur deck possible. To be fair, I think that the Zur deck isn't bad. Just... Yknow... This version isn't that good. The lack of Zur targets seems like the person playing this deck didn't want to commit all the way, and that'd be like playing a gifts deck without diverse removal.
May 28, 2015 5:04 p.m.
pumpkinwavy says... #46
The deck doesn't need many enchantment targets. 8 is enough. By attacking with Zur the Enchanter, you find Thassa, God of the Sea to make it unblockable, then find Spreading Seas over and over to lock them out of casting anything. Then Thassa, God of the Sea becomes active and you kill them quickly. If it's taking long to kill them or it's a race, get Steel of the Godhead. Detention Sphere is for whatever pops up. It's surprisingly powerful.
May 28, 2015 5:16 p.m.
Even with steel on him he has 3 power. It's not ground breaking. You will be outraced by a rhino if you bother to swing up until the point at which you get that lifelink.
May 28, 2015 5:20 p.m.
pumpkinwavy says... #48
Detention Sphere. And the rest of the deck deals with the rhino. I don't think the deck is prefect, but you have to give it some credit.
May 28, 2015 5:27 p.m.
Steel of the Godhead makes Geist a 4/4 (+4) unblockable lifelinker, I'm sorry, but it's going to fuck any Rhino in race, whatsoever.
bigguy99 says... #2
So much about this deck confuses me. This is like the RUG Splinter Twin midrange list from a while ago with Cavern of Souls + 19 creature types alongside Humble Defector.
May 26, 2015 5:43 a.m.