Reactions to Pascal Maynard drafting Foil Tarmogoyf in the top 8
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Posted on June 1, 2015, 3:12 p.m. by fluffybunnypants
I'm pretty sure that I would've done the same thing as Pascal.
Wow. Why in the holy name of fuck would you be angry, for someone selling the cards he owns? That's like me being angry over someone eating their cereal, that they bought themselves.
June 1, 2015 3:19 p.m.
TurboFagoot says... #4
No, for value drafting in the top 8 of a GP with a Worlds slot on the line.
For context, he was solidly in R/W double strike, takes foil Goyf pack 2 pick 1.
If you're value drafting at a GP, you can get even more value by not paying for a hotel and flight and staying home. Completely ridiculous for him to do that.
June 1, 2015 3:19 p.m.
TurboFagoot says... #5
Wow, people look into an issue before you start posting. People made those disgusted tweets while his draft was being broadcast, way before he put the deck up on ebay (Or announced his intention)
June 1, 2015 3:20 p.m.
That's actually a logical fallacy.
He went to the GP. He didn't KNOW he'd draft the goyf. Once he did he made the best of his present situation, took it and presumably left. The sunk costs fallacy tells us we should continue with something even if it hurts us economically. The correct answer is to maximise your current profit, forget the future costs and run.
I'm assuming he took the goyf and ran?
If he didn't and he just picked it and then ignored it then it's even more mind boggling. You can make a good draft deck with a few dud choices.
June 1, 2015 3:21 p.m.
ChiefBell - He made it to the semi-finals.
Also, TCGWolf & TurboFagoot, all 3 of those guys are good friends. The Twitter exchanges are just banter between friends.
June 1, 2015 3:24 p.m.
There isn't even an issue? The guy drafted a card that didn't really fit his deck, so what? If every single draft slot had to be gold for your deck, every draft deck would suck.
Furthermore, it's only the first pick of the second pack. A lot of things could come up that make whatever +Goyf a much better deck than R/W Double strike. Tarmogoyf is really just a solid draft pick whenever.
June 1, 2015 3:26 p.m.
TurboFagoot says... #9
He didn't take the Goyf and run lol it's a draft. He took it for his pick, finished the draft, and played the rest of the GP, losing in the semis.
He picked it over Burst Lightning for reference, an insane card in the format.
It's not about him knowing how he would place when registering for the GP and dropping money on a hotel, it's about outlook. If you're going to a GP to make the most money possible (Value) you're much better off not going, because most of the time (Even for pro players) you're not going to recoup all of your costs. The reason many pros go is for the pro points, the PT invitations, and other things dealing with the tournament circuit. (Such as a Worlds Invite that Pascal could've secured if he won the GP, which he was in great position to do at the point the pick was made)
Essentially, if you're goal in entering a major Magic tournament is to "maximize profit" you're not giving yourself the best chance of winning. Magic pros (Such as Pascal and everyone in the picture of Twitter) needs wins more than profits, as wins get them to more and larger tournaments.
It's a matter of greed and not taking the game seriously as a professional. The fact that he lost one of his games to a Burst Lightning made it hilarious.
June 1, 2015 3:27 p.m.
First off, fluffybunnypants is in the wrong for posting the tweets out of chronological order.
Second, what happened is that Pascal Maynard in the Top 8 of one of the MM15 GPs was not in Green and took Tarmogoyf a mediocre card in Limited over a Burst Lightning which is a very good card in Limited also in his deck. You don't drop from a Top8 draft in a GP with $4K on the line if you win. Essentially this came down to taking a value card in a draft where your EV is substantially higher than a Foil Tarmogoyf.
June 1, 2015 3:31 p.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #11
I assumed people watched the coverage, or would at least ask for clarification if they didn't understand. The image is courtesy of Reddit.
June 1, 2015 3:32 p.m.
What I am saying is that he probably did not enter to maximise profit, but once he realised he could then he did.
It is not unprofessional to make a single dud pick in a draft. It's his choice. Don't belittle his choices. If a player chooses to lose every game - so be it. It's not your problem, is it? Its theirs. He still got to the semifinals? There is literally no issue here.
He did not make a bad economic call. He took the correct card at the present moment to maximise profit. He probably did not plan on doing this so his motives going in should not be questioned.
For referencing maximising current profit in favour of projected, possible future profit is a good call.
June 1, 2015 3:34 p.m.
Rule #1 of the Internet, never assume. People will take literally what you say and post.
ChiefBell - If you want another reason why it was silly to take the 'goyf over Burst Lightning, currently Pascal Maynard is 2 Pro Points behind Alexander Hayne for a spot at the World Championships next year. Maynard COULD have gotten those points had he taken the Burst Lightning and passed the Goyf. At this level of competition, such a "economic call" is absurd. Would I pass a foil Tarmogoyf in a Top 8 of a GP? Yes. And Maynard should have too. The correct card was Burst Lightning, not Tarmogoyf
June 1, 2015 3:37 p.m.
1 single card in 40 that he had to draw at a particular time?
That reasoning is EXACTLY why humans are famously bad at making economic decisions.
June 1, 2015 3:38 p.m.
ChiefBell - Regardless of the reasoning, there is still a correct draft pick. At this level of competition you don't take the monetary value, you are expected to take the card best for your deck. Burst Lightning was the card best for his deck. End of Story.
June 1, 2015 3:53 p.m.
Except that the story doesn't end at you deciding what he should or should not be doing. From an economic perspective or otherwise. He has his freedom, you have yours.
June 1, 2015 4 p.m.
Rasta_Viking29 says... #18
Regardless of whether he made the correct MtG or $$$ decision, the lashing out by some of these pros is just embarrassing. They appear immature, whiny, and judgmental. I have to believe their actions are more damaging to their brand than Pascal's pack 2 pick 1 in the top 8.
June 1, 2015 4:11 p.m.
FAMOUSWATERMELON says... #19
Hm, foil Goyf over Lightning. Pretty sure I would have done the same.
June 1, 2015 4:17 p.m.
Servo_Token says... #20
Did he know that he was going to make it to the semis though? If not (which of course he didn't), you take the goyf because it gives you the most out of the event.
"Correct" is extremely opinionated in this instance because not everyone has the same views of right and wrong. I feel that he made the correct choice because he was getting the most out of being on stream, and getting the most out of his GP in the immediate. If you are under the impression that there is, can, and only ever will be one correct choice in taking lightning, i'd say you're just as wrong and shortsighted as the people bashing him for taking the goyf.
June 1, 2015 4:54 p.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #21
The pick for Pascal IMO is the Goyf. From what I've read of other players talking about his current state of affairs, he needed the money more than the Pro Points. As it turns out, the Goyf is making him substantially more money than the GP win would have (on EBay), and I think he made the right choice. Bad drafting, sure, but good for that man.
June 2, 2015 5:47 p.m.
Flying77lord says... #22
The best part of this saga is that Pascal will get the last laugh.
Aside from this being the best beginning of the story, the story will end with Pascal having more money in his pocket than winning Vegas several times over.
As of my posting, the most legendary Tarmogoyf (arguably the most famous individual MTG card ever) is selling on EBay for $16,000. It has more than six days left on the auction. At this rate, it may soar beyond the $50k mark. First place at Vegas got $4k as I recall.
Why is it worth so much? Because most of us would have done the same thing. That's what makes it such a good story. It's so easy to hate on Pascal, because none of the haters have ever had to make such a difficult choice in such a short amount of time. We all want to exalt the pros, but they're just dudes that play cards, just like the rest of us. And 99.9% of us would have drafted the goyf in a heartbeat. And guess what, in hindsight, I think we can all agree now the Vegas Goyf was worth it!
Cheers Pascal! Way to make history! Aside from the mega $$$, you just multiplied your fan base.
June 2, 2015 11:28 p.m.
Video link for the uninformed.
I agree with JWiley129 in that Burst Lightning was easily the better choice in terms of the deck he was currently drafting. He was off color by only 1? card at the point of the pick, and by the end of the draft he only had one solid piece of removal(Oblivion Ring). However, I don't think anyone can shunt someone for talking a $350 card. In a perfect world where value wasn't a factor it was an easy choice. but we don't live in a perfect world, and honestly, I felt the deck he drafted was actually pretty strong with or without the goyf. He got into the semifinals with it. If Burst Lightning hadn't been the nail in the coffin, I don't think the story would have been as big.
What do you do if you're passed a foil goyf? What if it isn't even close to your colors either? I think a huge overreaction was taken with the pros on this, as they've already begun to apologize for. If I was in his shoes, I'd certainly have taken it. If I was sitting next to him, and got passed the goyf, even pack 3 pick 2, I would turn and stare. I don't know how you could avoid to do so. I would have to look at the face of a man who could have that much reservation to pass up a free $350.
My favorite point I've seen about this is why doesn't this kind of reaction happen with cheaters?
June 3, 2015 8:49 a.m.
Is it worth mentioning that the Goyf is currently going for $16,000 on eBay? I've never seen a Burst Lightning that I would value at $16,000
June 4, 2015 11:11 a.m.
The most intelligent statement I saw was in Pascal Maynard's response. He quotes someone else:
"I had under 1 minute to take into account everything and I believe Martin Juza had the best way to resume my quick thought process. He said, ''Would you pay 500$ to have Burst Lightning in your draft deck.'".June 4, 2015 12:57 p.m.
I play at the shop where Pascal works and he regrets his choice. He's not in a ''Damn I shouldn't have killed my mom'' type of regret though, he laughs and makes jokes about it and like half of the world he's just wondering why the f*ck everyone is losing their mind. The way people reacted on twitter is very disrespectful and immature and they should be ashamed. Hopefully Pascal is a happy guy full of positiveness because that amount of social media intimidation could seriously break a spirit.
ChiefBell says... #2
What for selling the cards you own? Wow. Some people.
June 1, 2015 3:16 p.m.