More theories about Fetchland reprints
Spoilers, Rumors, and Speculation forum
Posted on June 27, 2014, 11:22 a.m. by trentfaris242
So hear me out. They've spoiled the Painlands for the Magic 2015 set. Both Painlands and Scrylands have no specific land type. If there was ever a safe time to reprint fetches, it's now.
If we were to see the fetchlands reprinted this fall, it would effectively make no impact on the current Standard meta as they could only fetch basics. They would essentially just be deck thinning lands in Standard.
This might be a stretch, but I'm really hoping this is what they are planning. Thoughts?
Servo_Token says... #3
It's 33 pages, so you will have to set aside some time, but it's a good read.
June 27, 2014 11:24 a.m.
Servo_Token says... #5
Most of the arguments against it are that they didn't know about the demand when making Khans, they were still running off of Modern Masters thinking that that was enough to satisfy the masses when developing khans, and that the difference between shocks was 7 years, so 4-5 years for fetches seemed too greedy.
June 27, 2014 11:29 a.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #6
All of that makes sense, but Wizards makes changes to their sets all the time. Often a card won't match its art because the text box gets changed at the last second, or a really busted card makes it through RnD because it was also added at the last second.
There's no hard evidence either way. Hell, everybody could be right and we could get some sort of new fetches. Let's just wait 'til spoiler season and bask in the hype when we finally get the news of new lands.
June 27, 2014 11:37 a.m.
To be honest, I think Wizards wants to give an even amount of friendly / enemy land options to everyone as they do not want to force specific colour combinations. That being said, they have released all 10 shock/scry lands in the past two blocks. I'm thinking they wanted to release only friendly lands in this block, so they added the enemy pain lands in M15 to balance it out.
While I would love to see fetch lands, I can't see them being in this set. I hope I'm wrong, but I can't see us having two sets of enemy lands, and doubt they want the Onslaught fetches to be running around in Modern (again, would be glad to be wrong there too).
June 27, 2014 12:50 p.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #8
MaRo has stated that he doesn't like the concept of "enemy lands" and "ally lands" anymore from a game design perspective. He wants decks and strategies to exist because they feel strong, not because they're the only ones that the current mana supports.
Based on that, I'm really not sure what they're up to with the pain land reprints. It is unlikely that they'll finish the cycle, so we'll have another set of only 5 rare duals in a core set.
June 27, 2014 1 p.m.
ChiefWannaHacka says... #9
Fetches might be too powerful with Courser of Kruphix in standard. And the above link/thread.
June 27, 2014 1:55 p.m.
trentfaris242 says... #10
Fetches wouldn't be powerful. Courser of Kruphix would. I don't mean to be "that guy" but it's worth mentioning this important difference. This is one of the best times to bring back fetches in my opinion since by themselves they aren't too good.
June 27, 2014 3:37 p.m.
Perhaps they want to balance the number of cards that have been printed in the cycle. Note how many times the ally painlands have been printed, and how many times the enemy painlands have been reprinted. Considering that current print runs are much larger than in 5E and 6E, they might be able to do it in one set.
June 27, 2014 3:47 p.m.
trentfaris242 - No, fetches are still good in a vacuum. It's just that they are INSANE with shocks and ABUR duals. All dual lands are good, especially those that ETB untapped, regardless of the costs associated with them.
June 27, 2014 3:50 p.m.
By itself Tarmogoyf isn't anything special either. Seems safe to print that too, right trentfaris242?
It's not like Courser of Kruphix doesn't singlehandedly negate the pay-life drawback on fetchlands, and still put you 1 life up, while also thinning your deck twice as hard. I'd never play 10+ fetchlands in a Courser deck because I can afford to pay 10 life and get 20 back.
/sarcasm
June 27, 2014 3:53 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #14
lol@anyone who thinks that if there were no shocks in standard wouldn't be good or would be for "deck thinning".
Half the time u run fetches, u pull basics. It fixes your mana perfectly. Yes it can be better to pull a shock, but even without shocks, fetches are sick.
June 27, 2014 3:55 p.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #15
Fetches are still quite strong by themselves, but they don't represent serious power on their own. They are incredibly good at fixing you early in the game, but it is easy to imagine situations in which you need GG on turn 3 and WW on turn 4, and fetching for basic lands sometimes can't get you there.
An opening hand of Forest , 2x Windswept Heath , for example, can't get you both GG and WW on turn 4. You still need a somewhat lucky draw.
June 27, 2014 3:55 p.m.
Servo_Token says... #16
By itself, Tarmogoyf is still a 4/5 for 2. It's not like it gets its ability from any specific card, it's just good. Hence $200.
I'd also like to point out that MaRo has been quoted saying that good lands are a commodity. They aren't going to just hand them out willy-nilly. We literally just got shock lands. There's no way that we are getting another great set of lands until at least a year past Khans.
June 27, 2014 3:59 p.m.
trentfaris242 says... #17
I'm on my phone at work so sorry about that typo. I didn't mean to cause a storm of correction against me :P
I meant to say they wouldn't be "too powerful". I'd love a reprint BECAUSE they're strong. But compared to when shocks are in the same format they are much, much weaker. Sure, there's great synergy between fetches and Courser of Kruphix , but that doesn't suddenly make fetches the strong card in that relationship. It's Courser abusing its mechanic.
That's why I said I hate to be "that guy". I was just pointing out a technicality.
Also, who said fetches thin your deck "twice as hard"? Fetches are great and do thin your deck, but lets not get carried away here using over exaggerated phrases. I can't remember (or cite) the specific article off hand, but I remember reading something on either SCG or TCGPlayer recently that showed that the deck thinning is not as game breaking as we often try to make it, statistically.
June 27, 2014 4:08 p.m.
trentfaris242 says... #18
@APPLE01DOJ If you're cracking them at the end of the opponent's turn you should almost always be grabbing shocks. Unless you're playing like Scapeshift or something that doesn't want a flexible mana pool.
June 27, 2014 4:16 p.m.
trentfaris242 says... #19
Lemme expand on what I was saying about Courser of Kruphix with an example. Still on phone so bear with me.
Nissa's ult is great. Not broken, but great. With a Courser of Kruphix out, it's insanely, unholy, extremely broken-good. You could grab 15 lands and have 15 triggers.
That doesn't suddenly make her ult insanely good because there's good synergy there.
That's all I was trying to say with fetches.
June 27, 2014 4:24 p.m.
ChiefWannaHacka says... #20
What I was referring to is the free shuffle from them with courser.forget the lifegain, but if I'm playing mono green I now have up to 8 lands that for the cost of a life can shuffle away things I don't need that are revealed by my courser. Sure the life is ok, but the shuffle is what's insane because standard usually has so few of those effects and not everyone uses them i.e. elixir of immortality.
June 27, 2014 4:46 p.m.
trentfaris242 says... #21
@ChiefWannaHacka I see what you're saying now. Sorry I misunderstood the first time.
June 27, 2014 5:05 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #22
I dunno. If I'm waiting until end of turn to play something I would rather pull a basic to play it. Especially since 3 mana = Blood Moon
online. I never fetch a shock unless I need to, or my mana has been completely fixed with basics. I understand why some one would pull shocks EoT, especially in a 3+ color deck though.
Also... Horseboy is sick!
June 27, 2014 5:14 p.m.
Feels like nobody read the sarcasm tag at the end of my post.
Feels like nobody understood what I was saying about Goyf either. Tarmogoyf is weak by itself, and especially weak in any slow environment. It is strong because of its synergy with other fast, strong cards in the Modern environment.
In the same way, Fetches aren't always strong by themselves either. But printing them now is putting them into an environment with strong synergistic cards in the form of Courser of Kruphix , Nyx-Fleece Ram and the Staff cycle. Fetchlands would just feed them more synergy, and could pressure burn and aggro decks out of Standard.
June 28, 2014 1:50 a.m.
trentfaris242 says... #24
I'm not disagreeing with you x754, but I still think now would be a relatively safe time for fetches.
June 28, 2014 6:39 a.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #25
Courser of Kruphix
has been in many Standard decks for months now, and burn is a thriving archetype. Printing fetches that sometimes net you one life isn't going to suddenly make burn terrible.
Servo_Token says... #2
I'll redirect you to every argument against fetches in khans ever, most of which are on our discussion page on Khans over on SRS.
June 27, 2014 11:24 a.m.