So......i guess it's worth 75 bucks....
Spoilers, Rumors, and Speculation forum
Posted on May 13, 2014, 2:28 a.m. by GoofyFoot
The Event Deck was spoiled today. I have to say I'm utterly disappointed. paraphrasing a quote I saw, it looks like a deformed child of soul sisters and B/W tokens. it's technical value via TCG is ~270, but there is just nothing in there that makes me want to buy that. No deck wants 4 Windbrisk Heights anyways....
I'm actually speechless. That list is terrible. Like actually terrible. After all the hype that came with this thing, I am thoroughly disappointed. Wow.
May 13, 2014 2:33 a.m.
@kmcree Right? all that speculation at Marsh Flats and Bitterblossom , and the don't even have the nicety to throw in some Godless Shrine . THERE ISN'T EVEN A SINGLE Hero of Bladehold .
May 13, 2014 2:39 a.m.
And no bob? Like seriously? No fetches, no shocks, nothing usefull at all! Wizards should be embarrassed for hyping this thing as much as they did.
May 13, 2014 2:41 a.m.
I can understand Dark Confidant not being in actually, as he did just get a reprint, but this is basically just a butchered version of a tier 2 deck that wizards wasn't even bothered to mess with. Competitive my foot. No kid is going to buy this for a modern FNM, because it's too expensive, No tournament player is going to buy this for a GP or a GPQ because it's not strong enough for any match up from a self constructed deck, and No kitchen table is going buy this minus dismantling it for 3 or 4 cards, and anyone dismantling this for Elspeth, Knight-Errant or Sword of Feast and Famine is a fool, because you can buy 3 for the deck's cost.
No target market, and no value. Conspiracy better not be this bad too.
May 13, 2014 2:49 a.m.
CommanderOfBolas says... #8
To be honest, I thought it was going to be worse. Don't get me wrong, this is bad. but it could have been much worse.
May 13, 2014 3:06 a.m.
Did I miss something, or has Spectral Procession been favored over Lingering Souls for a while in this kind of deck? I would personally prefer the Souls, for the flashback and the less color intense cost, but I might be wrong.
May 13, 2014 3:07 a.m.
@Dallie Lingering Souls is boss, and If you are seeing deck lists with Spectral Procession , but without souls, I'd would probably only be in mono white decks. Lingering Souls is definitely better in most every way, especially because you can get half now and half later, which is good in terms of board wipes.
May 13, 2014 3:17 a.m.
@GoofyFoot: Yeah, that's what my thoughts were as well (especially since I run 4 in my Orzhov Token deck). It seems however, that I apparently missed the fact that the Lingering Souls ARE in the decklist, which makes me the boy who cried wolf.. or well, you know.. didn't RTFdecklist
May 13, 2014 3:24 a.m.
Named_Tawyny says... #12
In case anybody wants to see all the stats on the deck, I've made a copy on here.
M:TG Modern Event Deck Playtest
Modern
SCORE: 0 | 0 COMMENTS | 1 VIEWSMay 13, 2014 3:31 a.m.
@Dallie: its okay, this deck list wasn't worth reading anyway.
May 13, 2014 3:31 a.m.
I would have considered buying it if it had a Marsh Flats or really any land that's relevant to the format, but this isn't worth it. Looks a lot like the casual deck my roommate made a week after learning how to play the game.
May 13, 2014 4:25 a.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #15
It's not horrible, but not that great either. Bitterblossom would've been a sweet add.
May 13, 2014 4:47 a.m.
It seems like people had some unreasonably high expectations for this deck. Event decks have never been top tier; they're supposed to be starting points for people getting into the format.
May 13, 2014 5:13 a.m.
Event decks almost always contain a few high value cards that can allow you to get iinto the format. This contains none - no shocks, fetches or other high value useful card. It has completely failed to do what it sets out to do - to provide new players with a semi-competitive deck that they can win a few games with.
May 13, 2014 6:01 a.m.
Sword of Fire and Ice is $25, Elspeth, Knight-Errant is $20, Path to Exile and Inquisition of Kozilek are $7 each. Event decks have a few high value cards but not that high value; they never had the best, most valuable cards in the format (except, arguably, the single shock land the last three had). I'm not saying this is a great modern deck or the best introduction WotC could have made for the format, but Bitterblossom or Marsh Flats or Dark Confidant were not realistic expectations to have of this thing.
May 13, 2014 6:24 a.m.
@WotC: Hey man, cool deck! But I really think you would be a lot better off by swapping
-1x Caves of Koilos
for
+1x Godless Shrine
The initial life loss is negligible compared to the pain you take from the Cave.
Otherwise cool deck! I know there's improvements to be made, but it's a place to start and you can always adjust it here and there when you feel it's necessary!
+1 from here, and you can check out my deck "SUPER-AWESOME-ORZHOV-DECK-THAT-COST-ME-750-BUCKS!" for inspiration if you want!
May 13, 2014 6:30 a.m.
Lame_Duck - I explicitly stated 'useful' high value cards. The deck as a whole is shambolic. What's Inquisition doing in here? Why a single sword?
They've thrown some high value stuff in - but it's not done in a useful, competitive way.
May 13, 2014 6:39 a.m.
The sword in there is Sword of Feast and Famine , not Sword of Fire and Ice . LOL. Why on earth would they put that in. It's terrible in this deck.
May 13, 2014 7:01 a.m.
I think you're right to criticise the decks design, but I still maintain that fetch lands were never a likely inclusion. Marsh Flats is a $45 card and would contribute a lot to pushing up the demand from established modern players for the deck, which would increase the price and render it less useful as a means of attracting new players into the format.
I'll admit I have basically no experience of modern, so maybe I'm underestimating just how poorly this will do at a FNM.
May 13, 2014 7:11 a.m.
It's a bad deck. They need to have put in maybe a few shocklands. Maybe a Hero of Bladehold and a few other things. The expensive cards they've put in are just useless.
May 13, 2014 7:13 a.m.
KrosanTusker says... #24
$75? Over here, preorders are going for 90 in proper money ;)
I really want to like it, but we were all hoping for at least one Marsh Flats
, realistic or not, and as has been said, the value cards they did include are a bit suspect.
I hope they decide to do another one next year or whatever -- the idea of a Modern Event Deck has so much potential -- but I guess if this flops, it'll put them off.
May 13, 2014 7:47 a.m.
Here is what I came up with that's about $2 more than the event deck, and that's mostly due to having Tectonic Edge s and Marsh Flats . All this Event Deck needed was one or two Modern staples to get people into the format (Bitterblossom , Marsh Flats , etc.).
Instead, you spend $75 on a deck you spend $75 to replace every card except for Path to Exile and Inquisition of Kozilek . You end up replacing all of the lands, the deck has the wrong sword, Soul Warden is out of place here, etc.
Really sad to see this is what they came up with. I will be telling those in my area to avoid the Event deck and to instead buy $75 in singles to build something from scratch.
May 13, 2014 8:10 a.m.
mathimus55 says... #26
I'm with Lame_Duck: expecting any high value staples is unrealistic. With Bitterblossom it just getting unbanned, all the speculation of the fetches getting a reprint in the next block or 2 and dark confidant being a $90 card by most accounts, it's silly that people would demand those cards. Most people looking to get into modern anyways have a fair amount of experience and know you can't take a precon deck and play out of the box competively.
May 13, 2014 8:18 a.m.
Dalektable says... #27
I was interested to see how this was going to turn out, as I am building B/W Tokens currently. I'm slightly disappointed, though It's a decent starting point I suppose. If sold at MSRP then this is an okay deal as a basis for building a good B/W Tokens deck though currently It's just not quite there. I am pretty disappointed not seeing the inclusion of Hero of Bladehold , one would think that would be a given to include...
May 13, 2014 8:20 a.m.
Although I don't the ink the deck is powerful, I think Wizards did a good job at creating a deck that provides modern played cards for players getting into modern.
This is not designed to be a money-grab, or a "stock up on traders" for people who already play modern.
If there were a single Marsh Flats or Bitterblossom , they would be completely sold out the day it's released... or it would be too expensive for new players to purchase (or both).
There is a long list of cards in this deck that are played in Modern, and many of which are used in multiple decks:
- Elspeth, Knight-Errant
- Sword of Feast and Famine
- City of Brass
- Inquisition of Kozilek
- Caves of Koilos
- Windbrisk Heights
- Path to Exile
- Tidehollow Sculler
- Path to Exile
- Spectral Procession
- Lingering Souls
If you look at the deck, M:TG Modern Event Deck, originally posted by Named_Tawyny, you'll see it's almost a $200 value of Modern playable cards. (Probably $150 if you exclude non-playable from the equation)
The fact that it's being "bashed" by people who currently play Modern, and simply think it should have more power-cards, makes me realize that it was well developed, and will likely be a step towards their goal of increasing the number of modern players. - I agree, it's not something you can just open, and expect to do well with, but it provides the basics for a few deck types.
I for one, will be buying 2x of these... I currently only have an Infect deck for modern, and Modern Masters was too limited in print, and too expensive to get enough cards to make another deck. - Two of these, plus some of the cards I already have should get me another playable deck.
The only downfall I personally find in this deck is the 4x Windbrisk Heights , and 4x Caves of Koilos ... partially because I am planning on buying 2x (I really won't need 8x of each of these)... but also because 4x is probably not great... too much life loss, and land coming into play tapped.
May 13, 2014 8:24 a.m.
I think that Wizards should have started with a coherent decklist and thrown some expensive cards in that fit with the theme, instead of throwing random cards together (some of which are expensive) and then trying to make a deck out of them.
IOK is out of place, the sword is out of place, arguably tidehollow is out of place, city of brass is out of place.
All good cards - but adding up to a shambolic deck.
I was hoping that what wizards would do is create a great deck and then add in some nice value cards.
May 13, 2014 9:15 a.m.
Now I don't play modern or at FNM (due to working friday nights), just table top casual every so often... Even I am shocked and slightly annoyed at this.... Sure some, if not most, of the cards are decent... BUT NOT IN A DECK LIKE THIS... This was rather underwhelming.... I wouldn't even bother this, not even for the Elspeth, Knight-Errant for just the reason GoofyFoot pointed out in post #6...
May 13, 2014 10:02 a.m.
BW Tokens runs 4x Tidehollow Sculler , and 2-4x Inquisition of Kozilek ... So I don't think they are "out-of-place". - Perhaps you think this deck should have Thoughtseize instead, but it's currently in Standard, so it's not difficult for new players to find.... Inquisition in not in print, and still used in Modern. It's much more attractive to players looking to get into the meta.
The sword is probably not the best for the deck... and City of Brass is probably there to compensate for the fact that they couldn't include Marsh Flats (would have caused marketing problems, as they want this to be for people new to modern, not instantly sold out to people who want power cards).
This deck is no less powerful in modern than Standard event decks are in Standard... some decent cards, good for a beginner, but not a complete Tier 1 deck. I feel Wizards did a great job wit this product.
May 13, 2014 10:19 a.m.
the sword kinda combos with the 4x Windbrisk Heights and the discard goes along with the Inquisition of Kozilek , Tidehollow Sculler and Duress . pro black helps against some modern removal and pro green helps a spirit token fly past a Birds of Paradise to trigger the sword's abilities.
it isn't a tier 1 deck nor is it meant to be. i see enough of a theme to make sense, and they picked their money cards based on the theme of the deck as well as information that is unseen to us (future reprint plans, extensive playtesting, etc).
there are enough maindeck and sideboard options to tweak this deck in a few different directions (tokens, hatebears, soul sisters to name a few), and some of the pieces that don't fit the direction the player takes the deck can be traded off for other low-medium priced alternatives.
seems fine to me. i don't want to buy it, but it's not targeted toward me. i have my modern deck and i don't need to buy this to rob it for value. that's a good thing for this deck that the commander precons don't have. now whether a newer player wants to pay $75 to get started in modern this way remains to be seen.
my one complaint is that it would have been nice to maybe have 3-5 event decks for modern, to allow a new player to have a choice on what style/colors they would like to play.
May 13, 2014 10:39 a.m.
"Wheres the Marsh Flats?
Wheres the Godless Shrines?
Wheres the value?!
So before some of you guys start the mob mentality of whining, you have to realize that this is an entry level product for people interested in Modern. Players that have no idea where to start, especially if theyve been playing Standard or drafting for a year. If Wizards of the Coast included one or two fetchlands, it would defeat the purpose of having an entry-level product on the shelves. Guess what would happen? Mark-ups.Suddenly that $74.99 MSRP Modern Event deck becomes $99.99 or even $149.99. Just like Commanders Arsenal, you wouldnt have players buying out the product, you would have scalpers and speculators clearing out stores just to resell and cannibalize them for their own trade binders or eBay auctions.
What happens to Lisa or Jeremy at FNM? Theyre not going to have a chance to buy the Event deck, let alone play Modern. The format itself is moderately more expensive than Standard , so it was a good decision by Wizards to not include these outrageously expensive Fetchlands in an entry level product. I would much rather have new players entering a new format rather than none at all."
Taken from a follower on my Tumblr. And I agree. Adding anything that expensive would have been a mistake.
May 13, 2014 10:51 a.m.
"It doesn't contain cards worth dozens of times the MSRP for me to buy and turn profit on. It is horrible."
Or, you know...this product isn't FOR people already playing Modern who wanted cheaper than market staples.
May 13, 2014 10:53 a.m.
I don't have a decent modern deck. I just playtested the deck on cockatrice, adding 2x Hero of Bladehold that I own. It worked pretty well, beating a green devotion deck pretty handily. I personally like the deck. I understand I can't take it to a gp and expect to win a game. But I will be able to have a good start to a modern deck that I can work with to make it into a decent deck.
May 13, 2014 11:03 a.m.
I pre-ordered one at MSRP so I have a decent set of cards to help me get into Modern. But the Sword of Feast and Famine is definitely for EDH...
May 13, 2014 11:04 a.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #37
Lame_Duck they've included Verdant Catacombs in a pre-con so y would Marsh Flats be unrealistic?
May 13, 2014 12:10 p.m.
There's a couple things going on. As people have mentioned, the deck itself is terrible. There are probably 8-10 cards in there that have absolutely no business being in the deck. Then, there are literally dozens of other cards that would've been better fits. I get that Marsh Flats is a $50 card, but most of the lands they included either don't fit (City of Brass ) or aren't particularly good (Caves of Koilos and Windbrisk Heights ). I would've much rather they built a landbase of mostly basics, maybe a couple Isolated Chapel , and 1 single fetch. That way, your average standard player could throw shocks in, maybe pick up a utility land or 2, and have a decent mana base. Instead, you're going to have to spend at least $40 just to get shocks, and then probably another $100 to get at least a couple fetches just to have a decent mana base to start.
May 13, 2014 12:29 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ I had actually completely forgotten that Vampire Onslaught had Verdant Catacombs in it. Bear in mind that it came out like 3 years ago though and fetch lands were a fraction of the price they are now. Plus, it kind of demonstrates my point that having a fetch lands pushes up demand and consequently the price significantly; Vampire Onslaught seems to be selling at about 4 times its original price. Part of this is obviously because it's an old sealed product, which means there's limited supply, but the Scars of Mirrodin event decks are even older and they're not selling for nearly the same price.
May 13, 2014 12:40 p.m.
There's a huge difference in printing Verdant Catacombs in a Standard Event deck, while it was sitting at $10-$15 and still in print... vs. printing Marsh Flats in a Modern Event deck while they are sitting at $50.
One supports the meta, while providing a nice little incentive for players to consider purchasing... the other makes it a "must purchase the max pre-orders" for anyone who knows the card, which artificially inflates the cost to 4-5x the MRSP, and would do nothing to assist players who are considering getting into modern.
Sure... they could put Marsh Flats in an event deck... but then the rest of the deck would have to be commons of a nearly unplayable or $0.15 value, so that the new players would consider purchasing it... The way they've set it up, it's worth purchasing to get into Modern, but won't be overly inflated or sold out too quick.
May 13, 2014 12:53 p.m.
@Rayenous: This deck isn't worth purchasing to get into modern though. That's the problem. The only way you would buy this deck is if you really want to play B/W tokens. There aren't enough playable cards to make the deck worth it if you plan to do anything else with it. And if you want to keep it as B/W tokens, you need to put so much money into it to make it playable that it isn't worth it for a beginner. A beginning modern player would be much better off building their own budget deck from scratch that fits their play style instead of buying this garbage.
May 13, 2014 12:58 p.m.
I honestly believe people aren't giving this deck any credit, and it deserves some. You pay 75 plus 2x Hero of Bladehold and you have a deck that is decent for modern fnm. It's not winning any major tournaments but what new modern player plans on going to a major tournament right away any way?
Obivously the deck needs to lose some cards, and gain some others. But it provides a new player with a decent start to a popular modern deck. In my opinion it is a great product for new modern players.
Now lets all stop overreacting. This isn't garbage, it's good for what it is meant for. A gateway deck for new modern players to play in modern fnms.
May 13, 2014 1:04 p.m.
"The only way you would buy this deck is if you really want to play B/W tokens. "
- Is there any deck they could have made that would have allowed them to play anything other than that deck archetype...? Of course they will be limited to BW tokens with a BW Tokens deck!
Sure, there are some cards they would need to make this better... as stated repeatedly, this deck is not intended or expected to win tournaments. It's enough for them to play, get a feel for the format, and perhaps pull of a win or 2.
To assume that they would need to get at least 2x Marsh Flats is a little off... the main thing Fetch lands do is mana fixing. In a 2 color deck, this is barely needed, and this has been more than compensated for with the other lands included. - The other thing it does is to thin out the deck a little... this effect is very minimal to start with, and would go unnoticed to any player new to modern.
I understand that a budget deck might be better for some new players... but the thing stopping many from entering is the lack of knowledge of the format. Having no idea where to start in deck construction (budget or not) is as much of a problem as the money. This event deck provides a large number of key cards used in the format, as well as a deck they can simply open and play, and a base concept to build on (or move away from if they don't like it... but at least they got some experience). - And all of this for simply buying a box and opening it... get in there and play before they have to trade, search, buy... get told by other players why their deck sucks, and why they need to buy $500 more cards before they should play.
I have only ever played Infect in Modern, as I don't have many cards from 8th edition to M13, when I started playing again (oddly, I would be better off in Legacy). - 2x of this deck will provide me with many playable cards that I currently need to make something other than Infect... and for the cost, it will actually be an investment.
Seeing as I'm one of the few people in this discussion with a view point of "attempting to get into modern", I can say that from this perspective, Wizards has done well.
May 13, 2014 1:34 p.m.
To the first point, if they had included something like Marsh Flats , or bob, or Bitterblossom , or any of the other higher money cards mentioned previously, even if they played the B/W tokens and decided they didn't like it, they would still have a money card or 2 that they could transfer relatively easily to a different build. Every money card in this deck, with the exception of City of Brass which has no business in the deck, is strictly playable in B/W tokens. If you buy this deck, then decide to build something else instead, you will have absolutely nothing of value from this deck to build on.
Secondly, I am also somebody who has been trying to get into modern for quite a while. I have lots of pre-8th edition cards, but fewer new bordered cards. I made the decision a few months ago to build myself a deck I would enjoy playing, build slowly on a budget, and gradually make it stronger. I'm very glad I made that decision instead of waiting for this deck, as it's just a complete waste of time. If you want to get in to modern, do a little research, find an archetype you like, and start playing around with it. Build something budget that you can eventually improve on piece by piece. But save yourself the $75 and DO NOT buy this deck.
May 13, 2014 1:49 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #46
It's not that bad of a list either. Path/IoK/Souls/Sword would all fit very nicely into a Junk midrange build. Especially if you add some of the standard staples that will rotate out soon like Voice of Resurgence
May 13, 2014 1:49 p.m.
Caves of kilos isn't a particularly bad card. It's fine. Grabbing a few shock lands is hardly an issue right now given their price, so I think it's reasonable. I would've liked to have seen some more reasonable creatures. I'm mystified why they didn't include some more battle cry cards etc.
I don't think it's a bad starting place, however I don't think I'd like to pay $75 for it.
May 13, 2014 1:51 p.m.
I love my phones autocorrect. Cave of koilos becomes cave of kilos
May 13, 2014 1:52 p.m.
@kmcree - Sure, if they included some of the money cards, they would have those cards even if they change their archetype... however, instead, they have a large number of cards that work in other archetypes instead... not really seeing why one is better than the other. - Path to Exile , Inquisition of Kozilek , City of Brass , Sword of Feast and Famine , Lingering Souls , Elspeth, Knight-Errant , Tidehollow Sculler , and most of the sideboard... all played in multiple archetypes.
This deck is good if you want to play BW Tokens... and it's good for people who simply want Modern cards they while they consider what to build. - If you're hard up on the cash and want to focus on one deck then I'll agree, this may not be the best. It's a good purchase if you want to go BW Tokens. - Otherwise, if you have a bit of cash to spend, want to delve into modern a little further and would like a variety of playable cards, this is a fair purchase... maybe even 2, if you want more of some of the non-4-of's, and have people who may trade for your extras.
May 13, 2014 2:36 p.m.
It's really not unreasonable to print Marsh Flats in a Modern event deck. The price is overly inflated because of Modern season. Seriously, the fetches have doubled in price from where they were 6 months ago, which is insane considering they're only five years old. Their price is starting to exceed the Onslaught fetches.
Even Bitterblossom would be fine. The card is only as high as it is because Lorwyn wasn't heavily drafted on paper and therefore the print run was low. Just look at Thoughtseize when it was $80. Now they're $40 for the original artwork, which is much more in line with their demand.
Saying they can't make a decent event deck because of individual price tags is just silly, especially since they can keep the event decks in print as long as they want and don't need to worry about them being sold out.
Named_Tawyny says... #2
Taking at the Sisters and throwing in a Brimaz, King of Oreskos would have been a nice touch, IMNAAHO. Maybe a bit odd though.
May 13, 2014 2:30 a.m.