All things Wolven

Standard Deck Help forum

Posted on March 26, 2016, 12:26 p.m. by clayperce

If you want to talk about Wolves and Werewolves in Standard, you're in the right place!

If you're looking for other formats, please drop by Werewolf EDH for Commander or Modern Wolves for Modern.

  • You're 100% welcome to post here asking for help on anything Wolven, though you may want to set up a separate thread as well, in the Standard Deck Help forum.
  • Please don't hesitate to post your deck in large format (it makes it easier for others to find the decks that are asking for help).
  • Here's the syntax for a large format deck ... just copy-and-paste, replacing the "gruul-wolves-soi" part with the "slug name" from your deck's URL:
    [[deck-large:gruul-wolves-soi]]
    

FNM (6 Jan 2016)

  • 1st Place (3-0): just-another-jundyard-dog-rec-12-5 by VexxValentine ($$$$)

FNM (23 Sep 2016)

Game Day (13-14 Aug 2013)

FNM (29 Jul 2016)

FNM (15 Jul 2016)

FNM (8 July 2016)

  • 1st Place (3-0): deck:naya-wolves-and-humans-bring-on-the-pain by snarlmkiv (Naya, $$)

Tues Standard (5 July 2016)

FNM (1 July 2016)

FNM (25 May 2016)

FNM (6 May 2016)

GAME DAY (30 Apr - 1 May 2016)

FNM (29 Apr 2016)

FNM (22 Apr 2016)

Some great posts that will otherwise be totally buried as the thread grows ...

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Sethlord says... #1

Decided to submit my own take on the deck focusing on Sage of Ancient Lore + Neglected Heirloom

Hungry Hungry Werewolves

April 13, 2016 6:43 a.m.

clayperce says... #2

AndyReveler and Everyone,
One other thing to keep in mind: The Bant deck from last weekend is $700 on TCGplayer, and the average price of the Top 8 is ~$500. I could easily have missed one, but I think the most expensive deck on this thread has been just a little under $300, and most are coming in between $100-200.

I'm thinking about the deck by Spootyone and EAK1791 above, and also a budget deck snarlmkiv has been working on. I'm kind of wondering if Budget Wolves might be an archetype worth exploring more ...

As an example, I ran a super-fun UR Thopter deck last season. There was no doubt it was a Tier 2 deck, but it was fully capable of hanging with the big dogs if I played tight and got a little lucky. And periodically thumping on ~$600 4C Rally decks and ~$800 Grixis Control decks with my little $115 wonder was just SO satisfying! :-)

Speaking of snarlmkiv's deck, please don't hesitate to check it out. I think a LOT of players would like to run this deck, and I'd like to make more people aware of it:


RG Zadafur Werewolves - BUDGET (Below $50!)

Standard snarlmkiv

SCORE: 4 | 4 COMMENTS | 197 VIEWS


April 13, 2016 9:34 a.m.

snarlmkiv says... #3

clayperce

My word. Thank you so much for the shoutout. I cannot thank you enough as it is. My only goal here is to provide everyone with a competitive chance at playing.

April 13, 2016 9:39 a.m.

Rasanck says... #4

Since people love the budget decks here's a budget version of my Wolves Who Bench Eldrazi deck.$21.50

Wolves Who Bench Eldrazi: Budget Version

April 13, 2016 11:55 a.m.

clayperce says... #5

Everyone,
Wanted to point out a couple articles, in case you hadn't seen ...

Writing for Werewolves: A light piece for us Vorthos types, about the names, art, and flavor text of our favorite cards.

Standard Snapshot: An in-depth look at what was played in SCG open last weekend. A few highlights ...

  • Wow, there's a lot of Declaration in Stone out there! Not great for anyone, but especially not for Wolf tokens. Any ideas for good sac' outlets? Or other responses? Well, besides "Play Blue" of course! :-)
  • Lots of Westvale Abbey  Flip too. I'm interested to see if that's just a gimmick or it's going to last ...
  • And of course a ton of Archangel Avacyn  Flip ...
April 13, 2016 11:56 a.m.

AndyReveler says... #6

So a lot of the decks I've seen posted here are pretty good and have a lot of potential, but there are a few things I'm a bit concerned about.

  1. Decks running other creatures. This in itself isn't really a problem as there aren't really any rules that say a deck has to be only werewolves to be a werewolf deck, but if the creature ratio of other creatures to werewolves is high, then it's not really a werewolf deck, just a deck with a few werewolves. My point with this is that there are some really good decks that are being posted and shared, like that red deck wins one, but I can't help but feel they could be a bit better maybe without werewolves.
  2. Decks with too many spells. Having at least a few spells is necessary for most any deck, but werewolves punish us for playing too too many. The main point of playing werewolves is to get them to flip over as soon as possible and use their strenghts to overwhelm the opponent. It's kinda hard to do that if you're playing other spells half the time protecting them or playing removal or whatever. I think 12 spells is good guideline for a mostly werewolf deck, aggro or not, and it's best to make sure those spells count as well (obviously). When werewolves were a thing the first time around all you needed (in my humble opinion) was Moonmist, Full Moon's Rise and Searing Spear (or some other type of removal). Those three spells were enough to deal with many threats and still let my werewolves transform (not counting moonmist effect cause you don't play that just to transform). I understand we don't have cards quite this powerful (or supportive) just yet, but playing too many spells diminishes the power and effectiveness of werewolves.

Anyway, this is just my two cents based on some observations. Werewolves are far from a perfect deck type and probably wont be anything more than tier 2, but I really enjoyed playing werewolves as this tribe was my introduction into my magic journey and I would like to see them succeed as much as possible.

April 13, 2016 5:47 p.m.

snarlmkiv says... #7

I'm going to playtest my deck RG Zadafur Werewolves - BUDGET (Below $50!) against tier-1 decks tonight and tomorrow, as well as some new meta's in the shop.

I'd like to ask how are the other WW players handling other types of decks?

April 13, 2016 7:57 p.m.

Kizmetto says... #8

I agree halfly on the other creatures in the lists non werewolves being 'non werewolf' decks such as my Coco list (now anyway) and the RDWerewolves, (i think it will get better/more wolven with Eldrich) but for now there just isnt enough strength/support to fully run only werewolves and remain toe-and-toe with other top tier decks, but thats just my opinion. Speaking of i'd like your opinions on it. Lycanthrope Rush

Exactly, original werewolves had much more support with Immerwolf Huntmaster of the Fells  Flip Moonmist and Full Moon's Rise and Rancor it was just so much...faster and stronger. Since SoI doesnt quite have that level of support (YET!! Cmon eldrich moon) I dont think running %100 werewolves at the moment (Pre ElM) is the best way to go about it. I want my werewolf list to at least win FNM level tournaments/ Game Day.

clayperce That werewolf flavour article was a great read!

and that Westvale Abbey  Flip is certainly scary... As for sac outlets in Gruul? Hmmm dont even have a Goblin Bombardmentkind of card.... what about Evolutionary Leap? Thats all i could find... and Westvale Abbey  Flip.

April 13, 2016 8:15 p.m.

clayperce says... #9

If anyone's looking for a REALLY tough gauntlet, I loaded up Frank Karsten's "aggregate" decks from the SCG Open. His article and the decks are over on this thread.

April 13, 2016 11:27 p.m.

PatScar says... #10

Fiery Conclusion is the best sacrifice effect in Red right now. I wouldn't maindeck that card in a wolf deck, but it might be worth sideboarding against an opponent with Declaration in Stone.

I don't think the Gruul wolf deck should focus on werewolves, myself. There are some great Wolf creatures right now: Timberpack Wolf, Scourge Wolf, Silverfur Partisan. Everything that boosts werewolves also boosts wolves. So making the most of those effects is my focus, rather than spending time flipping weres. (I actually wish Duskwatch Recruiter wouldn't flip; I prefer his top side.)

April 14, 2016 3:27 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #11

If you're going to make a Gruul wolf deck then yeah.

The only thing I don't like is it's 5 damage to target creature only (but like you said you wouldn't run in mainboard anyway), but I guess it assures it kills most creatures including Avycyn, assuming they have creatures of course :/ Also great flavor text.

April 14, 2016 7:53 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #12

Well my deck and sideboard isn't what I ultimately want (honestly don't know what to have sideboard and want to run at least 2 if not a set of Collected Company ), but this is my current build atm (things can always change before fnm).


Werewolf Heirloom

Standard AndyReveler

SCORE: 10 | 13 COMMENTS | 1430 VIEWS | IN 6 FOLDERS


...on a side note, I find the idea of a Scourge Wolf swinging around an Ashmouth Blade hilarious XD

April 14, 2016 9:33 p.m.

snarlmkiv says... #13

Has anyone ran with their wolves deck in any organized play? I'll be playing FNM later with my Zadafur deck.

April 14, 2016 10:09 p.m.

Kizmetto says... #14

good luck this week at fnm everyone! i will run my coco wolves next week, i built a second deck (pop goes the blister pod ) to play tonight at fnm.

April 14, 2016 10:42 p.m.

Blueleader96 says... #15

Hey all! I just found this group AND I just finished putting together this deck here.



I'd love it if anyone could give it a look see, or if anyone needs inspiration for their own decks! All my reasonings for the cards is included in the deck description.

April 15, 2016 12:41 a.m.

AndyReveler says... #16

A few hours away from fnm pack, let's hear some last minutes advice and tips. What are/should you (be) running in your sideboard and why?

April 15, 2016 1:35 p.m.

Last minute tips:

Combat end step happens after the combat damage step. Players have priority here. You can use Clip Wings during the combat end step, before main phase two, to force them to sac the one flyer they kept alive.

April 15, 2016 3:55 p.m.

clayperce says... #18

In case you hadn't seen: Melissa DeTora has followed up on her Arlinn-Thopter brew from earlier in the month (back on post #129), with a full Werewolf brew. You can check out her list here.

April 16, 2016 12:04 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #19

So...I made it into top 8 but lost due to some mistakes on my end. I will also note that I did not play of of the decks on that list though. I'll post some of my Military Intelligence here and the rest on my deck page.

Neglected Heirloom and Moonlight Hunt performed superbly for me last night. Once a single heirloom transformed, it was enough to get them worried and put me ahead. I think 3, or possibly 2 is good.

Arlinn Kord  Flip is a great card, but It either took a turn of damage and she didn't help my board state, or i was already ahead so her help didn't matter much. I may cut her out.

Breakneck Rider was not as bad as people said it was, it at it's worst was a solid 3/3 body for 3, at its best it gave everything +1/0 and allowed me to swing for game. Having said that, I did take it out for more removal if i felt it was necessary since i didn't know what else to cut.

These were just a few highlights of my deck's performance last night, again, ill post the rest on my decks page as well as a deck update if anyone wants to check it out.


Werewolf Heirloom

Standard AndyReveler

SCORE: 12 | 4 COMMENTS | 1895 VIEWS | IN 8 FOLDERS


note: this is my second time posting this, i dont know if it was and error on my end or it got deleted for some reason, but it was kind of upsetting :(

April 16, 2016 3:27 p.m.

clayperce says... #20

AndyReveler,
Thanks much for the info!

By the way, it may have been an error by either T/O system or your ISP too, but just so you know: We can only delete comments on decks, not on threads.

April 16, 2016 4:16 p.m.

BoB_6082 says... #21

Hey guys I stopped by to let you all catch a glance of my deck. It's as competitive as I could get it. Don't mind my previous comments, I hadn't playtested enough to really know what I was talking about. But now it's a gr8 competitive werewolf deck. Have fun!

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/the-full-moons-rise/

April 16, 2016 5 p.m.

abby315 says... #22

Hi guys! This deck isn't wolves or werewolf tribal, but the whole point was to build a deck that took advantage of how good I think (and, probably, we all think) the lovely werewolf Arlinn Kord  Flip can be in the right deck! It's got a fairly full primer so I hope I can inspire some people in the Jund direction :3


Arlinn on the Midrange (Competitive Jund w Primer)

Standard abby315

SCORE: 20 | 7 COMMENTS | 2401 VIEWS | IN 13 FOLDERS


I'm trying to prove she's not just a win-more card, or a fragile little weenie that dies to the slightest whisper of burn, which seem to be the two popular conceptions so far. Suggestions and everything appreciated! In testing online it seems competitive and versatile, perfect for the unknown-FNM-meta. :)

April 16, 2016 8:59 p.m.

BoB_6082 says... #23

Hey guys I stopped by to let you all catch a glance of my deck. It's as competitive as I could get it. Don't mind my previous comments, I hadn't playtested enough to really know what I was talking about. But now it's a gr8 competitive werewolf deck. Have fun!http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/gruul-wolf-tribal-competitive/

April 16, 2016 9:10 p.m.

clayperce says... #24

BoB_6082 and abby315,
I know its obvious, but not everyone on this thread is a guy.

Sure, "guys" is a gender-neutral term for many people, but not for everyone :-)

Thanks!

April 16, 2016 9:25 p.m.

abby315 says... #25

clayperce ha yeah! My bad. I am one of those non-guy people, after all :P

I'd edit it, but I can't? Thanks for lookin' out for everyone.

April 16, 2016 9:39 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #26

folks*

April 16, 2016 10:28 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #27

I like folks since I'm from Texas

April 16, 2016 10:28 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #28

folks and y'all, lol

April 16, 2016 10:42 p.m.

abby315 says... #29

Oh yeah btw, I'm building an Arlinn Kord  Flip EDH deck (my playgroup's allowing it-- she's about the same power level as the EDH-legal walkers, anyway, if not worse haha) which is DEFINITELY werewolf tribal, if anyone is interested. I'm super excited to build it and add to my tribal EDH decks :)


Hunt Your Friends by the Moon (Casual Werewolves)

Commander / EDH abby315

SCORE: 1 | 2 COMMENTS | 137 VIEWS


April 17, 2016 12:39 a.m.

snarlmkiv says... #30

My post seems to have gone missing re: my RG Zadafur Werewolves - BUDGET (Below $50!)'s performance last FNM and Saturday's casuals.

3 Rounds, best of 3 against the following decks:

1.) Red Wolves with Burn and Removals2.) BG Elves3.) BW Lifedrain Ally

A Mirror Match: Going against WolvesMy match went 1-2, in favor of the opponent. The first game went well, till he started burning off Zada. Silverfur was a great sideboard because he popped up tokens when spells were cast. The pump spells were great life-savers too. I dwindled my opponent's life down to 4 before he was saved by Chandra's Ignition...

The second match went in my favor as I curved out well. Had 2 Silverfurs and Zada out by turn 6, so you can imagine the token flood.

The third match was a repeat of the first match.

2nd round - BG ElvesWell, this one went 0-2 on my end. The elf bomb was way too much and curved too early for my wolves. Combat-wise, I had the enemy on his toes but Tajuru Warcaller and Shaman of the Pack were way too much to handle.

3rd round - BW Lifedrain AllyThis one was 1-2 in favor of the Allies.

I took the first round because I got my creatures early. Again, Silverfur and Zada took control because there were no removals.

The second and third round went to my opponent. He was able to get his core cards and simply withered me away. The flying creatures were also a problem as I did not draw out Vines of Recluse.

I ended up in 6th place. I won one booster and bought two more. The prize booster contained Arlinn Kord  Flip so I just added her to the deck.

My thoughts:

Game Trail is not enough to run even on a budget. I feel that Cinder Glade is needed but it's going to drive the price of the deck to more than $50. But the upgrade is worth the money I guess.

My thoughts on the Kessig Forgemaster  Flip Hinterland Logger  Flip and Scourge Wolf as two drops:Kessig has oomph but I feel scourge and the first strike make him a decent threat for a 2-drop. I replaced my Timberpack Wolf for Scourge Wolf and I will let you know how things go.

Hinterland is quite a stretch but she becomes quite a handful at 4/4 trample, so I will be adding her in lieu of Kessig Forgemaster...

I am also thinking of adding removal spells like Fiery Impulse because I feel that a little board control goes a long way but have not decided on which card to take out.

Confront the Unknown is a great card for the Investigate function and the buff function secondary. My friend, who ran the Red Wolves, agreed with me when it came to the wolves' draw cards. Expedite and Confront are decent draw cards and I added one more copy in.

Vines of the Recluse is a life-saver and is better saved when Silverfur is out.

I hope this feedback helps everyone...

April 17, 2016 1:35 a.m.

AndyReveler says... #31

Alright, I think at this point, my deck is the best it's going to get until the next set, gonna start focusing on my Jund build now.

I think no matter what kind of werewolf deck we play we don't want to have too many cards that cost 4 or greater in our deck, I think 4-8 tops. I've narrowed down the best choices for this spot as well. In no particular order, they are as following.

  1. Zada, Hedron Grinder seems to be the most popular choice.
  2. Arlinn Kord  Flip, I'm a bit disappointed in how she played out in my deck, but there's still plenty of time to test.
  3. Collected Company you play this early enough and the opponent doesn't have an answer, the games as good as yours.
  4. Pack Guardian now some of you might think I'm crazy, but hear me out. This card is essentially a wolf collected but it's only other cost is discarding a land and that's optionally, at the very least it's a 4/3 with flash, at its best, it discards a useless land in your hand and you get a 2/2 as well. It deserves consideration, especially for budget builders.

April 17, 2016 2:44 p.m.

snarlmkiv says... #32

AndyReveler

The list makes sense. Don't suppose we could come up with a list of spells for staples right?

April 17, 2016 8:12 p.m.

Blueleader96 says... #33

AndyReveler

Spot on analysis of Pack Guardian, it's seriously underrated.

April 17, 2016 9:58 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #34

There's not really much id consider a staple in a wolf/werewolf deck apart from Moonlight Hunt which is in most versions of werewolf decks as a 3-4 of snarlmkiv. Howlpack Resurgence is pretty good too, although not necessarily a 4 of, and the more aggro decks choose to not run it. The other spells just depend on your deck type, Neglected Heirloom  Flip and Arlinn Kord  Flip are also great with werewolves, but again, depend on your build and I wouldn't consider them staples.

April 18, 2016 12:24 p.m.

Rasanck says... #35

Here's a couple of cards to consider.Might of the Masses should be heavily considered no matter if you're running the Zada deck or not as it can really screw things up for your opponent. Swing with all your creatures you wish, wait for them to declare blockers, then cast that on a creature with trample or on a creature that doesn't have a blocker assigned to it. It's also great for defense.

Timberpack Wolf is a 2/2 for 2 that gets crazier the more you have. I've constantly had three out as I've ran four of them, and 5/5's for 2 is not a bad way to spend your mana in my book.

April 18, 2016 12:48 p.m.

Ryjo says... #36

I feel like many people are running Scourge Wolf in places they shouldn't. I am going to outline some factors to look out for when deciding if Scourge Wolf is right for you.

  1. Will having on turn 2 screw me out of playing other cards? For 2CMC, most werewolf decks are playing something like Duskwatch Recruiter  Flip/Lambholt Pacifist  Flip/Quilled Wolf/Ember-Eye Wolf or the like that can be played while having less restrictive mana costs. If you spend your first 2 turns getting mana ready, you are locked into one card and it makes playing any other colored instants more difficult. While getting out those first 2 turns can offer you more flexibility.

  2. Does your manabase support the ability to reliably have the out on turn 2? If you can't reliably get that mana set up, you are losing valuable tempo, a 2/2 first strike on turn 2 is great, on turn 3 is good, on turn 4 is not good. If I wanted to run Scourge Wolf, I would look for a manabase that is at least two-to-one ratio of to .

  3. Does Scourge Wolf provide you with enough firepower? It's a 2/2 with first strike that you may get to double strike, but anything with 3 toughness is likely to stonewall it. If we look at Duskwatch Recruiter  Flip/Lambholt Pacifist  Flip/Quilled Wolf/Ember-Eye Wolf, they each have some upside to then that makes them more of a threat that their initial P/T.

April 18, 2016 1:19 p.m.

Rasanck says... #37

Ryjo Scourge Wolf Really starts to outshine everyone when you start pumping him. Brute Force ing Scourge Wolf does a lot better on dealing with the enemies heavy hitters than a Duskwatch Recruiter  Flip because you're way more likely to take them out and leave your dudes standing than having a trade.

April 18, 2016 3:58 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #38

If you don't care about running pure werewolves, Scourge Wolf is definitely a good choice, Game Trail and Evolving Wild will help get you that double red turn 2.

April 18, 2016 5:19 p.m.

Ryjo says... #39

Rasanck, that is very true, but you still need to build your deck towards wanting on turn 2, otherwise you'll always have to make the choice between the wolf or all of your other 2 drops.

AndyReveler, I'm not saying that Scourge Wolf is a bad card, I do in fact like the card, but that seems too restrictive to me unless I was playing a deck that was heavily red. Those cards will help get , but there is the possibility that you have 1 Mountain and 1 tapped Game Trail on turn 2.

April 19, 2016 8:36 a.m.

Rasanck says... #40

I love Timberpack wolf and he's always a great alternative drop to scourge wolf

April 19, 2016 9:45 a.m.

BoB_6082 says... #41

Rasanck lambholt pacifist, duskwatch recruiter, and kessig forgemaster are all better two drop options. Lambolts a 2 for 4/4. Duskwatch makes it so the assault never stops. Finally kessig forgemaster gets rid of 5/5s and pesky first strikers.

April 19, 2016 7:05 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #42

I don't know if you guys have seen this deck yet,


Baby I'm Preying On You Tonight

Standard BlueEyes

SCORE: 5 | 5 COMMENTS | 1440 VIEWS | IN 1 FOLDER


but i think it's a great deck that focuses on Silverfur Partisan, but the main difference is the main activation card, Dual Shot, not only is it a wolf trigger, but removal for the two of the top decks right now. Go give it a look and like it if you like it of course.

April 20, 2016 12:06 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #43

Also, this is a very important note for those of you who underestimate Neglected Heirloom  Flip, heirloom doesn't care which way cards transform, as long as they do. This is very relevant later game when your werewolves have trouble staying on one side, and once you get your Ashmouth Blade it stays that way, unlike the werewolves. Yeah the cost is expensive on the other side, but that's why you switch strategies and stop focusing on the sword! Anyway just really love this card, going to a small tournament tonight with a slightly different CoCo build, with heirloom still looming around of course.

April 20, 2016 12:14 p.m.

clayperce says... #44

AndyReveler,
That's a really good point about Neglected Heirloom  Flip; thanks!

Good luck (and good skill) tonight!

April 20, 2016 12:19 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #45

I forgot to mention this since last Friday, but yeah, it's pretty great. I really do want to round it off to a 4 of, but just don't have the space and it runs the way I want it too already, I just like having sets. >_<

April 20, 2016 12:39 p.m.

clayperce says... #46

Everyone,
You may have already noticed this thread: I Need desperate help with my werewolf deck.
But in case not, Tederollz could use a hand with ...


Zada's Pack

Standard Tederollz

SCORE: 1 | 60 VIEWS | IN 1 FOLDER


Thanks!

April 20, 2016 7:39 p.m.

AndyReveler says... #47

My deck preformed horribly today...too much land when i didnt need it or not enough land when i did...Neglected Heirloom  Flip shined when i got it, I'm not running enough creatures for Collected Company, I drew Moonlight Hunt like once and it didnt do much, i didnt get Howlpack Resurgence when i needed it...it was just eh...gonna change up my strategy again and either sideboard hunt or heirloom making my deck a bit slower for more creatures to get the most out of CoCo, or Cut CoCo for...idk for what :/

April 20, 2016 11:20 p.m.

snarlmkiv says... #48

Who's running with Wolves for FNM this week? I know I am...

April 21, 2016 1:11 a.m.

Rasanck says... #49

snarlmkiv ME ME ME ME ME ME

April 21, 2016 9:55 a.m.

snarlmkiv says... #50

Rasanck Let us know how it goes, yeah? I tweaked my deck now (new version found on the decklist). Running with a more streamlined spell list and added more creatures in for that decent early ramp...

April 21, 2016 10:16 a.m.

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