Newbie needs help getting into Standard
Standard Deck Help forum
Posted on Feb. 16, 2019, 4:46 a.m. by Farel
Hello,
I have tried getting into MTG several times, and always gave up, because I couldn't construct any decent deck, especially with my lacking funds.
Now I got some cash, but things still seem as confusing as before. Bought a UG Merfolk deck from someone, used it at FNM, and got whacked badly. I only scored a victory in the 4th round when fighting against a 3 colored deck that got mana screwed.
I looked for advise, I got told that if I lack dual lands, I should play mono green. I looked up several deck lists, and of course, in my huge collection of cards, I at best had 3. Some friend cheered me on, told me to build my own deck with all I got. I spend so many hours planning it all, balancing things. Brought the deck to FNM and got curb-stomped. Not a single victory, game or match, with most of the players even outright asking "What is wrong with your deck?!". Some advising me to buy a pre-made deck, some pushing me to wait until some pre-made decks are released in March, while a friend tells me not to, that I should keep playing until I figure out what I'm doing wrong, and I can't deny that this feels incredibly frustrating to me as a newbie.
Maybe it's dumb of me to seek advise, considering how most often it's me getting dragged into opposite directions, but I want to give it a try.....
I would like to play a UG or G deck. Deck-type doesn't matter, creatures might not matter either. I'd like it to be strong enough to win something every now and then at FNM. I'd also appreciate it, if the deck could be something to hold onto. I wouldn't want to be unable to play it in a few months. If these are my general outlines for what I'd like to play, then what type of deck should I strive to build?
Thank you very much for any input.
I took a look at your list and it looks good to me. You're probably going to lose a lot until you learn how to pilot your deck, and that's just the fact of the matter. It takes time to learn your deck and how to make the right plays in the right situations. It's also important to play against other decks and learn about the decks in your meta.
My advice is to keep running with what you have for now and make adjustments after playing it for a while.
February 16, 2019 9:51 a.m.
multimedia says... #4
Hey, Merfolk unfortunately can't compete in Standard even with new Incubation / Incongruity and Benthic Biomancer :(
Depending on what kinds of decks you're against at FNM the top decks in Standard right now are $500. These decks cost this much because of three color manabases and mythic rares. The more colors you play the more money you will need to spend on a playable manabase. This doesn't mean that all decks are this expensive. If you like aggro then there's plenty of less expensive options.
You can make monoblue fliers aggro for $100, monowhite History aggro or monored burn aggro for about $150, Azorius aggro for $200. These decks can compete and win at FMN and these deck prices include full sideboards. They're all relatively simple to play, easier than most decks to learn quickly if this is something you care about.
Honestly, you want to be in white not green if you want to play aggro because white gives you the most one drop creatures as well as Venerated Loxodon , Benalish Marshal , Unbreakable Formation , expensive but powerful History of Benalia and Conclave Tribunal which is a very good budget removal spell that can remove any nonland permanent. You can add blue to white for more options, but doing this means count on adding $50 to the total deck price because you'll need 8x rare dual lands.
If Green is the color you want to play than aggro is not the best option. Green is good for midrange, but midrange is not a type of deck you play with a low budget especially with green. The current explore package: Jadelight Ranger , Merfolk Branchwalker and Wildgrowth Walker is not very expensive and it's powerful, where you want to be with green.
These go well with Golgari; deck is $200-300 depending on how many Carnage Tyrant and Vivien Reid you want to play. These cards are powerful, but expensive and you want at least one of each to increase the competitiveness of the deck. Black is added to green for some less expensive cards: Find / Finality , Ravenous Chupacabra , Midnight Reaper and nice sideboard options. Vraska's Contempt is an expensive black card and depending on your FNM meta, the amount of Planeswalkers you're against, you may or not need it. As a midrange deck Golgari is pretty easier to understand, but it's going to be more expensive than other aggro decks.
If any of these options interest you I offer more advice if you choose one.
If Simic is what you want to play than my advice is look at midrange not aggro. But as far as competitiveness Simic is worse than Golgari. If I was to build a less expensive competitive Simic midrange I would build around Hadana's Climb Flip using the explore package of creatures with Growth-Chamber Guardian and Zegana, Utopian Speaker . Hydroid Krasis is by far the best Simic creature in Standard, but it's ridiculously expensive. Blue provides some good sideboard cards.
Here's an example Simic Climb Midrange.
February 16, 2019 11:42 a.m.
triproberts12 says... #5
Play Commander. The decks don't rotate, so your deck won't be worthless in a couple of months, and people don't say douchey things like "What is wrong with your deck?" Simic is also the most powerful color pairing in Commander, and if you're the "Johnny" type that likes planning and balancing your deck, you'll enjoy how wide-open your options are for building.
February 16, 2019 5:44 p.m.
Darkshadow327 says... #6
I agree with triproberts12. EDH (in my mind) is vastly superior to other formats. Commander is a super fun, social, and casual format. While yes, decks are bigger, it can can be cheaper since you don't have to collect full play sets of expensive cards. All you need is one copy of a card and it can switch between decks as needed. If you asked around I'm sure you could find some people to play it with.
I do agree with simic being the best color combo though. From a competitive standpoint in commander might just take it. Orzhov and Esper () are also super fun colors to play in that can be really powerful if built right.
February 16, 2019 7:19 p.m.
What kind of budget are you trying to stay within? You might be able to do a mono-green stompy deck. Cards like Llanowar Elves help you to quickly ramp into big stuff like Ghalta, Primal Hunger or Gigantosaurus .
February 16, 2019 9:09 p.m.
PhyrexianWombat says... #8
The aforementioned Commander/EDH is one of the best ways to play, I think it might be close to what you're looking for.
Are you at all familiar with it and its rules? Do your friends ever play it?
February 17, 2019 1:15 a.m.
I did play Commander twice against a friend, both times he provided me with one of his decks. The positive comments received here certainly make me think about the possibility of a UG deck.
As for standard, I can't exactly make a choice yet... I'll have to think a lot about whenever Standard should be something that I'd still be interested in
February 17, 2019 7:56 a.m.
Standard takes a long, long, long, long, long time to improve at.
Even longer if you are learning how to build your own Standard decks.
You have to know the top decks back to front, and which ones are prevalent in your meta.
You have to learn which cards to put in your Sideboard, and how to tweak it as the meta evolves.
You usually have to spend money to buy one of the top decks, or get stomped over and over and over.
I have just given up playing Standard after 5 years of dedication to it, primarily because I got tired of everyone playing the same type of decks week in and week out.
I always built my own decks. Due to that I think it was a year of playing each week, before I won a game.
I ended up being able to build decks that won tournaments, but that was through spending at least three hours every day learning the current meta, tweaking my decks, and practising.
"while a friend tells me not to, that I should keep playing until I figure out what I'm doing wrong"
Your friend is giving you extremely poor advice. You are not going to learn to be a better deck builder simply by playing FNM.
You won't get enough games under your belt, and you also won't be playing much against decks which beat you, to see how to beat them.
Practising on your own, or against people in Magic Arena or Magic Online will teach you what you need to know better. Or a free program like Cocatrice.
I got better through playing decks I had built against the other top decks in the meta. As I said, three hours every day.
You cannot build a deck that will do well at FNM unless you are prepared to spend money.
Good cards give you a better chance at winning. It's as simple as that.
Restricting yourself to colours is also unhelpful.
This is the question you should be asking - do I want to win FNM?
If you answered "Yes", but want to stick to a certain budget or certain colours, then FNM is not for you.
It takes time, money, and dedication to win in the current FNM environment. It also takes using the colours which are currently the strongest.
As far as Commander, you can buy a pre-built deck and see what your local playgroup is like.
It may not solve all your problems as some groups are super competitive, leading to more stomping. At least you won't be too out of pocket if you buy a pre-made deck.
The third option I wish someone had told me when I first started playing Magic is to just play casually with friends at home, or with a friendly casual group at your LGS.
My play group does a variety of things to try to keep everything more casual:
-
play with Commander pre-cons
-
play our own format called Frontier Brawl (same rules as Brawl but with the cards available in the Frontier format)
-
play Archenemy
-
play Planeschase
-
play with a mini cube
Everything is fairly relaxed and a heap more fun.
Good luck with whatever you decided to do.
February 17, 2019 9:36 a.m.
Standard is kind of a trap and it gets expensive to keep up with. I only played in Standard back when the Return to Ravnica and Theros blocks were in rotation. I continued playing for a bit when Khans of Tarkir rotated in, but after Theros rotated out I realized that the upkeep of making new decks was going to get really expensive. I lost a lot of interest in the format as a result.
I will recommend following the aforementioned suggestions to try Commander. Decks are pretty cheap to boot, and if you buy a precon it's even cheaper to start up. It's not like cards will rotate out either, so you will be able to rest easy knowing that you're investing in a format that won't lose value in a year, and your deck will always be playable for years to come.
February 17, 2019 10:29 a.m.
I'd like to thank everyone for the wonderful support and advise. I see that Standard is not for me. I'll ask around how big the Commander groups are at my gamestore, and then I'll look into decks :)
February 18, 2019 1:01 p.m.
Feel free to post another thread if you need help deciding on a commander once you look into it some more and start narrowing your choices down. You can also post on my wall if you'd like some help with anything and I'd be happy to lend a hand. I'd say one of the hardest parts of Commander is deciding on your very first commander that you want to build around.
With that, one of the biggest mistakes that people make is selecting a commander that doesn't really match their preferred playstyle and a new player in general who commits to a deck that they find to have little to no interest in can ruin the format as a whole for them too. I have brewed probably hundreds of Commander decks at this point, but I have only narrowed my choices down to a select few that I have decided to build on paper in my years of playing in this format. I'm probably just a little too critical of myself, but I only really put together something on paper when it embodies what I intend for it to do and fulfill a specific role on the table that I'm aiming for. Regardless, I believe choosing a first commander is a very intimate and thoughtful process that may take time for you to sort out. Luckily you have a community of people who are here to help you if you have any questions about the format and offer specific commander suggestions for what roles or archetypes you want to build around. If you have an affinity to a certain color or combination of colors, that can also help with suggestions.
I wish you the best of luck. Just remember that I, as well as many others, are here to help you if you have questions about anything. Cheers.
February 18, 2019 1:30 p.m.
triproberts12 says... #14
Yay. Everyone loves some Commander. It's pretty much Magic as Richard Garfield, Ph.D. intended. If you want to see what your options are, I recommend checking out EDHREC. If you click on the Commanders tab at the top, you can see what your options are in each color identity, and if you click on the themes (tribal, +1/+1 counters, graveyard, etc.) tab, you can see if any of those styles of decks speak to you, and the site will show you what decks across the internet from sources such as TappedOut run in those decks. The other thing you can do is, if you have pet cards you would like to build around, you can enter those cards in the search bar, and it will tell you how many decks that card is played in, and what the most common cards are to see it run alongside.
I know you said you don't care much beyond liking UG, but, to get you started on ideas, if you like UG Merfolk, I recommend Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca if you want to go hard tribal or Tatyova, Benthic Druid if you want to draw cards and ramp. I built her as Druid tribal, and the deck is a blast. If you really don't care about creature type, but putting out an army, drawing cards, and taking extra turns is appealing to you, Edric, Spymaster of Trest is powerful and fun. If it's the counters aspect of Merfolk you enjoy, Experiment Kraj is a fun one, and if it's playing at instant speed that appeals to you, Rashmi, Eternities Crafter is the pick.
If you want to branch into a third color, you can have your Merfolk (Lorwyn goodies that come in UB or WU such as Sygg, River Cutthroat included) and your counter theme with Thrasios, Triton Hero + Reyhan, Last of the Abzan / Ishai, Ojutai Dragonspeaker , or you can go enchantress with Tuvasa the Sunlit .
Before you get started, here's a useful video by The Professor on basic deck construction, and here's another Tolarian Community College video on choosing a Commander.
Check out the full list of options on EDHREC, especially in the themes section, and good luck!
February 18, 2019 3:49 p.m.
Darkshadow327 says... #15
I'm with DiverDown, if you ever want help I'm here as a resource Farel. I also have an EDH Tribal Series that I have created. In commander I have found that Tribal is super fun, strong, and relatively straightforward to play. If you want to build a tribal deck and need some ideas my Tribal Series can be found here.
February 18, 2019 5:15 p.m.
I can't deny that Merfolk and their philosophy did fit me quite well. I overall like combo mechanics, powering up, and things like that.
Also, I wish to say that I do own some more rare cards, which could potentially be helpful for future upgrades of whichever deck I'd get: - Hinterland Harbor - Temple Garden - Clifftop Retreat - Azusa, Lost but Seeking - Myojin of Infinite Rage - Scion of the Wild - Earth Surge - Novijen Sages - Sensei's Divining Top
Is there anything out there for me? Some pre-made commander? Is there anything out there that I could potentially create with my cards? Is there something that I could build towards?
February 19, 2019 1:04 p.m.
triproberts12 says... #17
I don't know what your financial situation is like, but Top and Azusa are pretty valuable, and I might just trade them for handfuls of $5-10 cards for whatever deck you choose to build. If not, Azusa is a good fit for Tatyova, Benthic Druid . Top is still good in EDH, although some people frown on it for how it can slow games down. The best deck for it is Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow . I would stay away from Earth Surge shenanigans. Wrath of God effects are very common in EDH, and turning your lands into creatures for more than a single turn is dangerous.
Here's a review of the most recent preconstructed EDH decks that Wizards makes. They function right out of the box, and the WUG deck has been rated the best to play as is, lining up well with your color preferences and the dual lands you have.
February 19, 2019 2:48 p.m.
I would argue in favor of keeping both Azusa and Top because they are relevant staples, and Top can honestly be slapped into any deck really. Azusa is more niche, but in the right deck she certainly has a lot of value.
February 19, 2019 4:31 p.m.
Do NOT trade away Sensei's Divining Top .
It's brilliant in Commander.
Never trade one card for a pile of other cards. You will probably end up with chaff.
You have to realise that the only reason someone will give you tonnes of their cards for one of yours is that your card is extremely valuable/useful.
Start a topic asking for help in the Commandr deck help forum, if you haven't already, and also post on the profiles of people who have offered to help you.
Asking for Commander help in this forum will probably not be useful. I myself know little about it.
February 22, 2019 8:32 p.m. Edited.
Is this the Fish deck you're using?
Merfolk return
Standard*
2 COMMENTS | 58 VIEWS
The reason you're losing is you're not playing the two strongest cards for the deck (which are also the reason you play the deck in the first place)!
Those cards are Deeproot Waters and Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca . You should have 4 of each. I'd recommend the following decklist:
Lands:
========================================================================
4x
Breeding Pool
(or
Simic Guildgate
if you're on a budget)
5x
Forest
4x
Hinterland Harbor
6x
Island
4x
Unclaimed Territory
Creatures:
========================================================================
2x
Benthic Biomancer
4x
Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca
4x
Kumena's Speaker
4x
Merfolk Branchwalker
4x
Merfolk Mistbinder
1x
Merfolk Trickster
4x
Mist-Cloaked Herald
4x
Silvergill Adept
1x
Tempest Caller
3x
Watertrap Weaver
1x
Zegana, Utopian Speaker
Other Spells:
========================================================================
1x
Spell Pierce
4x
Deeproot Waters
Sideboard:
========================================================================
2x
Carnage Tyrant
4x
Dive Down
1x
Merfolk Trickster
1x
Sentinel Totem
1x
Shapers' Sanctuary
2x
Sorcerous Spyglass
2x
Spell Pierce
2x
Thrashing Brontodon
You should have no problems steamrolling non-red aggro decks, control, and have okay match-ups against midrange. You won't beat RDW/Burn, so if you get paired up against them don't sweat it if you lose. R/W variants are easier to beat. Just keep Goblin Chainwhirler in mind and don't get 10-for-1'd by overextending with 1/1s.
Spell Pierce and Dive Down laugh in the face of boardwipes (like Deafening Clarion or Settle the Wreckage ) because you can often just go full HAM and keep 1 mana open, which will force your opponent to tap out for the wipe. They get BTFO'd and you kill them anyway.
Watertrap Weaver and Tempest Caller can often end the game just by creating so much tempo, especially against decks that rely on smaller amounts of large creatures.
You should still get a Kumena, Tyrant of Orazca even if you decide to play EDH because he's a powerhouse of a general.
TheGoldenTim says... #2
Your Deck is probably pretty deece... Your sideboard is where its at. thats the situational part that needs to be strong against the current metas. Merfolk is fun to play, and as a tribal deck can work out very well when the combos are pulled off.
I recommend taking your experience in losing and learning more about the oppenent's style and deck, and how to combat against it.
February 16, 2019 5:52 a.m.