Aristocrats Deck and Thatcher Revolt?
Standard forum
Posted on May 29, 2013, 7:49 p.m. by thezeke
I'm piloting a pretty standard Aristocrats deck (apart from the sideboard) and am thinking about replacing two of the four Lingering Souls with two Thatcher Revolt . I feel like the synergy that card has with this deck is insane. I can see the only downside of it is being cancelled and then you can't flashback from the grave.
Are there thoughts about why no one is running this card in this deck? Does anyone else think Thatcher Revolt could take this deck up one more notch?
Thanks for the thoughts. I definitely see your point. I get that each copy of Souls is 4 tokens, but I guess my curiosity stems from wondering if this will make the deck quicker. I also think of it as a strong sideboard option in the event your opponent is running graveyard hate.
May 29, 2013 8:12 p.m.
Thatcher Revolt works well with Blood Artist in an aggroey way. You would get that damage in much faster with Thatcher Revolt than Lingering Souls .
Assuming blood artist was out:
If you had Thatcher Revolt
: deal 3 more damage to their players or creatures plus another 3 at the end of the turn you cast it (or more if their creatures died from blocking).
If you had Lingering Souls
: deal 2 additional damage the next turn after the turn after this one but no extra damage from Blood Artist
necessarily - especially since the lingering souls are evasive.
Assuming no blood artist, you get 3 damage in immediately from Thatcher Revolt and in an aggro deck, getting damage in quick is critical. I think a lot of aggro decks aim to close up the game in a matter of a few turns, less than 5 sometimes (often ... maybe even usually). It would take 5 turns just to get the extra 2 flying tokens to do any damage using flashback (unless you also have ramp - but I don't remember seeing any). Anyway, if an aggro deck doesn't pretty much win by the end of turn 6 or 7 it is probably in trouble.
I don't believe many mtg cards are "strictly better" - I think that is what makes it more interesting than a lot of other TCGs.
May 29, 2013 8:34 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #6
I don't follow Standard much, but I can tell you it probably isn't in your interest to make this substitution. Lingering Souls is reusable and gives you fliers that stick around beyond the turn they are created. Thatcher Revolt kind of pigeonholes you into committing to an attack that turn, and it's pretty useless unless you can get through your opponent's field. The tokens created by Thatcher Revolt also aren't capable of helping you later on as blockers or future sacrifices to Falkenrath Aristocrat or Cartel Aristocrat .
May 29, 2013 8:45 p.m.
Lingering Souls is what makes The Aristocrats stomp Midrange because of how well they work with Sorin, Lord of Innistrad . The point of having the card is for chump blocking. Once Sorin, Lord of Innistrad makes an emblem, you can one for one Thragtusk and two for one Restoration Angel .
Thatcher Revolt doesn't match that role, since the tokens don't stick around.
May 29, 2013 10:46 p.m.
If you're doing this change at a higher REL tournament with no excessive testing I'd suggest not making the change. If you want to do the change for FNM or to start trying it out I'd say go for it and write down the results.
May 29, 2013 11:59 p.m.
Thank you all for your thoughts. It may be a little too Magic Christmas land and does hurt the mid game.
May 30, 2013 12:26 a.m.
notamardybum says... #10
I'm torn between running Lingering Souls and Gather the Townsfolk
gather the townsfolk is only 2 to cast, and in my aristocrat deck I don't have sorin (yet). i think it definitely help sacraficing humans over spirits for falkenrath aristocrat, plus it helps to get out humans faster and bumping up my Champion of the Parish . turn 3 swing with champion for 10 alone? yes please, how? Silverblade Paladin
June 1, 2013 4:45 a.m.
not realy on topic but for the Thatcher Revolt card. what bout using this in some for of batalion deck? 3 mana instant batalion trigger even if just for a turn
mind i dont play those kind of decks so i wouldnt be capable of telling if it would be worth it. but it sounds interesting.
June 1, 2013 5:01 a.m.
@notamardybum: Lingering Souls isn't used for attacking. It's used for chump blocking. It puts your opponent in a really bad position because you can use one token to trade with one of their creatures, or double block. Then, you flash it back. Lingering Souls gives tremendous amounts of tempo and card advantage.
The problem with Gather the Townsfolk is the tokens don't have flying. You can't stop Geist of Saint Traft with auras on him, or Restoration Angel , or Vampire Nighthawk , or any of the other creatures that have flying and are problematic.
June 1, 2013 6:12 a.m.
notamardybum says... #13
@sylvannos: I know its used for chump blocks, as is the human tokens from gather the townsfolk, but lingering souls wont boost up falkenrath aristocrat OR champion of the parish. Theres just more synergy with gather the townsfolk
June 1, 2013 4:06 p.m.
Aristocrats already has Knight of Infamy , Cartel Aristocrat , Doomed Traveler , etc. Feeding a Falkenrath Aristocrat tokens from Gather the Townsfolk is just begging for it to get hit by Tragic Slip . Gather the Townsfolk still doesn't stop the problem of Restoration Angel , Obzedat, Ghost Council , opposing Falkenrath Aristocrat s, Angel of Serenity , or the occasional Desecration Demon (to which you can just block and not give a +1/+1 counter).
June 1, 2013 9:40 p.m.
Ised to run this combo. I had it in for one night and then promptly removed. Its not a good idea
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #2
While the Thatcher tokens are humans and have synergy there, they don't have evasion, which is a BIIIG plus to the Lingering Souls tokens.
Also, don't think of each copy of Souls as two tokens. Think of it as four. Four 1/1 flyers that stick around beat 3 1/1 humans any day.
May 29, 2013 8:07 p.m.