Build around or build with: Demonic Pact
Standard forum
Posted on Aug. 19, 2015, 10:18 a.m. by ducttapedeckbox
I've recently become very interested in Demonic Pact, and have been toying around with some different shells (BuG, BUg, GB, UB), all with varying success. It's impossible to brew for post-rotation without BFZ spoiled, so I've been experimenting to see what shell fits it best and familiarize myself with how to use it. Throughout my testing, a friend made a good point:
Is Demonic Pact a card to build around, or a card to fit into another deck? I'm looking for any insight or experience with it.
100% a build around card. When a card requires you to dedicate slots to it so that it can operate correctly, it automatically becomes a build around card.
This is not Siege Rhino where you jam 4 copies automatically in anything playing with at least abzan colors.
However, I can see the card as a finisher in RB burn, but maybe I am crazy like that :)
August 19, 2015 10:30 a.m.
canterlotguardian says... #4
Void Snare could actually have a use. Oh wait that's rotating out. Crap.
August 19, 2015 10:32 a.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #5
That's what I thought. You need to have ways to reset the Pact, but it takes 5 "cycles" to win the game. I guess if the game is locked down, this is possible. Ugin, Tasigur, and Silumgar also all help.
What are your thoughts on the colors for the deck? I'm leaning towards Sultai for Sultai Charm and Den Protector, and maybe other goodies from BFZ. Nissa is also pretty good in it.
@ canterlotguardian - Disperse, Rite of Undoing and Silumgar's Command :)
August 19, 2015 10:38 a.m. Edited.
I have got all the pieces of the UB shell for the deck on Contract from Below (Origins and Tarkir). With all the pieces there, a couple of bellowers and an Ojutai, I Think esper or Sultai will be the way to go, depending on BFZ and what removal it brings.
August 19, 2015 10:44 a.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #8
@ Boza - Removal is my biggest concern. We NEED a Hero's Downfall replacement. Sultai Charm is really pushing me towards Sultai, need that Revenge removal haha.
Plus, if we see a good target for Bellower, then it'll be great. Going to miss Invasive Species though.
August 19, 2015 10:48 a.m.
JANKYARD_DOG says... #10
I think BU is the way to go here Blue for bounce back and black for discard/removal. Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip fits the theme if you can include things you can discard and recur from the yard. Maybe Bloodsoaked Champion for that. Blue could also include cards that exchange control so you can give them the enchantment once you've used 3/4.
A different idea just dawned on me too. You could go BW making it enchantment oriented using Starfield of Nyx and enchantment hate/sacrifice to buy it back and other tricks. Just a thought.
August 19, 2015 1:30 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #11
@ Mj3913 - The BW idea is interesting, but it currently doesn't have many effective ways to remove/bounce the Pact.
I'm a control player through and through, so UB or BUG is what I'll likely build. I think we've established that the Pact needs to be build around so that you don't kill yourself with it.
I won't be able to finalize a list until we see BFZ though.
August 19, 2015 1:39 p.m.
JANKYARD_DOG says... #12
In this case with Starfield of Nyx it becomes a creature so anything that sacrifices a creature would do. To name a few white spells for enchantment hate; Fate Forgotten, exiles I know but it does the job in a pinch. Enlightened Ascetic ETB effect, double effective with recurrence. Tragic Arrogance not specific, but you don't have to choose to keep the pact, SB likely.
As for creature sacrifice, Exploit would work in black. Maybe Qarsi Sadist, Vulturous Aven, or Sidisi, Undead Vizier. Could be tricky though considering all Enchantment Creatures are cycling out soon. Blood-Cursed Knight would fit well with the enchantment theme.
August 19, 2015 3:17 p.m.
If you make Demonic Pact a creature with Starfield of Nyx, then you can actually just kill Demonic Pact with it's own ability. It'll deal 4 to itself, and you'll gain 4. Although this would mean you're running an Abzan/Orzhov enchantments deck. Which means you could play Invasive Species in an Abzan variant.
August 19, 2015 3:22 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #14
I've just been oblivious today, that's a fair point. It does require having enchantments though and both a pact and starfield at once. Esper is also an option there for the bounce.
August 19, 2015 3:41 p.m.
I have a guy at my local gamestore at FNM that plays a demonic pact deck. I practically have the deck memorized, or at least most of the key components.
I believe he has an Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, Disperse, Jace, the Living Guildpact in order to bounce or remove Demonic Pact. I can't tell you the numbers or copies for certain, but that is what he's got.
August 19, 2015 8:37 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #16
Ah yeah that's going to be the cookie cutter UB list that I start with.
Supplant Form would be interesting in the Esper/Starfield version, but probably too "cute."
August 19, 2015 8:56 p.m.
You could always use Clever Impersonator instead of Supplant Form.
August 19, 2015 9:01 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #18
The benefit of Supplant Form is that it would reset the Pact that goes to your hand while keeping one on the board. I guess it would be decent because the 
from Supplant Form could be considered the Disperse cost and the 
could be considered the Demonic Pact cost. It's even an Instant, but does cost 6 mana.
August 19, 2015 9:22 p.m.
RedDiomedes says... #19
Supplant Form can't bounce an enchantment.
I think Demonic Pact is a cool card but not necessarily very competitive. You have to pact so many cards to make it work and not risk killing yourself. Not to mention watch out for the counterspell that kills your enchantment removal.
August 20, 2015 8:29 a.m.
JANKYARD_DOG says... #20
RedDiomedes; Supplant Form can bounce it it Starfield of Nyx has turned it into a creature.
Agreed that counters could be a pain, but as I mentioned before there is sacrifice to consider. Sac it once 3/4 choices have been made, then bring it back with Starfield.
August 20, 2015 9 a.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #21
It's still a very cute interaction. It also requires 5 enchantments, and there aren't many worthy enchantments currently in Standard.
August 20, 2015 10:10 a.m.
JANKYARD_DOG says... #22
Aura's count ducttapedeckbox so you could include a control aspect with Pacifism, Suppression Bonds, etc. Recurring removal/reduction with Weight of the Underworld.
August 20, 2015 11:07 a.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #23
Maybe if it was the current standard with Nyx-Fleece Ram and Courser of Kruphix and Banishing Light. I don't think those enchantments would have as big of a board presence. Sigil of the Empty Throne and Herald of the Pantheon are things too actually... hmm.... brewing time.
August 20, 2015 11:11 a.m.
I played three out of four games tonight where people used Demonic Pact against me.
In each of those games people used Starfield of Nyx in combo with Naturalize to destroy Demonic Pact then bring it back to the field.
One person also played a lot of Enchantment Creatures to make Demonic Pact a Creature, then hit me with it and Starfield of Nyx.
Ow.
Aegis of the Gods was one of the Enchantment Creatures paired with it.
August 21, 2015 10:04 a.m.
Wait Argeaux, did he have 2 Starfield of Nyx out? The rules text says "each other non-aura enchantment", so Starfield itself doesn't become a creature.
August 21, 2015 1:48 p.m.
selesvyaloverer8 says... #26
i think it fits best in a shell that plays a value game and has a few ways to bounce or destroy it. ex. a BUG deck that runs a few sultai charms and a few disperses alongside a cookie cutter bug midrange shell. Woodland bellowers to fetch nissas and other value 3-drops, languishes, tasigurs, den protectors, etc.
August 21, 2015 2:18 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #27
That's my current plan, selesvyaloverer8. Note that Woodland Bellower cannot fetch Nissa, Vastwood Seer Flip.
We'll have to see what BFZ brings.
August 21, 2015 2:47 p.m.
Errast yes, he had two of them out.
Sorry, I should have specified that.
He also had two Demonic Pact out! It was not my best match.
August 21, 2015 3:48 p.m.
ducttapedeckbox says... #29
Having more than one Pact out is SO scary. Like damn. It's been close aha, I think I've only lost once though.
August 21, 2015 3:50 p.m.
selesvyaloverer8 says... #30
you get to draw a lot of cards off of the pacts. and ducttapedeckbox i actually read the card soon after i posted that and was disappointed. there should be some good value in bfz
Argy says... #2
I always think that a card needs to have a reason to be in your deck.
That being said - what kind of deck could Demonic Pact enhance?
Something where card draw had an impact is the first thing that leaps out at me, but there are obviously others.
August 19, 2015 10:28 a.m.