Dealing damage to planeswalkers before their "+" ability is used
Standard forum
Posted on Aug. 21, 2013, 6:01 p.m. by beewithdirtypaws
I was playing a game at FNM against a Jund midrange deck and he played a Garruk, Primal Hunter , sometime before my brother told me that I could deal damage to a planeswalker with an instant spell like Searing Spear before the player with the planeswalker "+" them, so I did Searing Spear the other player's Garruk, Primal Hunter in response to him playing him and he said he could still use the "+". I was just wanting to make sure that was the way it would work.
You can't play Searing Spear
until you have priority. Here's how the situation works:
Your opponent plays Garruk, Primal Hunter
.
Your opponent has priority after casting the spell; he passes priority to you.
You pass priority to your opponent; Garruk, Primal Hunter
resolves.
Your opponent has priority, so you can't do anything until he does. You opponent activates Garruk, Primal Hunter
's +1 ability.
Your opponent has priority after activating the ability; he passes priority to you.
You have priority; you can now cast Searing Spear
targeting your opponent (intending to redirect the damage to Garruk), but it will not kill Garruk as he is already at 4 loyalty counters.
August 21, 2013 6:16 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
Questions like this belong in the Q&A.
@Ringleader: That's incorrect, partially.
When a spell resolves, the active player gets priority. Assuming your opponent cast Garruk, Primal Hunter normally (that is, he or she cast Garruk at sorcery speed), then your opponent is the active player and will get priority after Garruk resolves. He or she now has priority over an empty stack, so he or she may activate a loyalty ability of Garruk. You can't do anything until your opponent passes you priority.
The loyalty counters are added as the cost of the loyalty ability, so by the time your opponent puts the ability onto the stack and passes to you, Garruk will be at 4 counters. Killing Garruk at this point will not counter the ability.
August 21, 2013 6:18 p.m.
Bobgalarneau says... #5
Yes he can still use the planeswalker ability. While it is true that you can only use planeswalker ability at sorcery speed, you had to have the priority to cast your Searing Spear .
Here is how it worked. Opponent cast garruk, you both pass priority to let it resolve. Garruk resolve. Opponent have priority and place garruk ability on the stack. You get priority here and can cast Searing Spear . If you do, garruk's ability will still resolve but it will have less loyalty counters.
Hope it was clear enough.
August 21, 2013 6:19 p.m.
Schuesseled says... #6
The only way you can kill garruk before he has the chance to use his ability is if your opponent makes the mistake of electing to wait. Say for example prior to activating garruks plus one he decides to use a Searing Spear of his own against your Silverblade Paladin or whatever, now you can kill his garruk at instant speed before a counter can be added.
August 21, 2013 6:25 p.m.
I remember there being a lot of time in a round wasted when someone had to choose an ability for their new JTMS back when he was standard as only the +2 got around him dying to Lightning Bolt .
August 21, 2013 7:51 p.m.
SevenSeasAgo says... #8
@Epochalyptik I must've misread it. I thought it was asking if he could use the +1 in response to the Searing Spear
August 21, 2013 7:54 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #9
@Ringleader: That's what the question is directly asking, but the actual scenario is important because it seems OP never gave his or her opponent the opportunity to activate one of Garruk's abilities after it resolved. In the context of the question, it was appropriate to go a bit deeper.
SevenSeasAgo says... #2
"306.5d Each planeswalker has a number of loyalty abilities, which are activated abilities with loyalty symbols in their costs. Loyalty abilities follow special rules: A player may activate a loyalty ability of a permanent he or she controls any time he or she has priority and the stack is empty during a main phase of his or her turn, but only if none of that permanent's loyalty abilities have been activated that turn"
So no. They can't. The stack has to be empty.
August 21, 2013 6:07 p.m.