Elspeth
Standard forum
Posted on Sept. 12, 2013, 11:11 a.m. by sadiuh
Can Elspeth from theros see standard play? for me it looks to slow for aggro decks and for midrange decks 3 tokens is not what you want to be doing turn 6 and for a lot of decks in standard right now like red deck wins the -3 will be fairly useless. The emblem seems pretty underpowered. Thoughts on elspeth?
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #3
The new Elspeth is amazing. Her abilities do exactly what they should do, and work perfectly together.
The "only" question is whether or not she'll actually fit in a deck. Wizards has printed a lot of damn amazing cards recently that nobody decided to play. Duskmantle Seer is one of them. Even Olivia Voldaren was mostly ignored for about half the time she was legal.
September 12, 2013 11:27 a.m.
GoldGhost012 says... #4
The only reasons I don't like the new Elspeth is because she's a little too slow to put into my Modern deck and because she seems like a mix of her two previous incarnations. Otherwise she's pretty awesome.
September 12, 2013 11:41 a.m.
awesome for control decks. It gives another win condition for American control and might replace Assemble the Legion mainboard: she's more versatile. At least a sideboard option for control.
September 12, 2013 11:55 a.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #6
Don't base new cards off of old cards. New 'Speth is great at what she does, and is one of the best walkers ever printed at protecting herself. She's got all that AND a bag of potato chips. Or a spear. I always get those two confused.
September 12, 2013 11:56 a.m.
GoldGhost012 says... #8
She has the magical bag that actually contains potato chips instead of air.
September 12, 2013 12:04 p.m.
Elspeth, Sun's Champion is very powerful. As a control finisher, she floods the board with a ton of bodies very quickly. Her -3 is a Day of Judgment against midrange, and her ultimate is game-over, considering you'd have upwards of 9 tokens at that point.
September 12, 2013 12:19 p.m.
Too slow for what she does... I can see her being useful for edh but I think the other two versions are superior to this one.
September 12, 2013 2:02 p.m.
She's a control card. Nothing's too slow for control.
September 12, 2013 2:06 p.m.
Turn 6 you get 3 1/1 tokens or you get to kill fatties, there are other cards that do what she does but they do them better. She's too slow.
September 12, 2013 3:12 p.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #14
The key word in your last post was "or". Giving yourself the option to do either one is where she shines.
Given a clean board, she makes 3 tokens to protect her from almost anything in the format aside from direct burn. The next turn she can wrath the board, survive it, and then continue to make more tokens in the future. Eventually she ults and the game ends.
On a clogged board, she comes down and takes the role of the Supreme Verdict you weren't able to draw before then.
Options OP.
September 12, 2013 10:57 p.m.
I get that she has great abilities but you're waiting until turn 6 is my point... you can get more tokens for cheaper and faster, you can also clear the board for cheaper and faster. She just seems to clunky to me at 6cmc and only 4 counters on her where Elspeth Tirel does pretty much the same but can come out a turn before and wipes more of the board. This newest elspeth seems to be a slower version of her former selves.
September 13, 2013 7:38 a.m.
Control decks expect to push the game well beyond T6. She's a win condition and wrath in one. But you would add her as a win-con, not in place of the wrath you already would have in a control deck. That's what makes her awesome. For example, I could see her fitting right into my American control deck over Assemble the Legion . Why? Both provide a win condition mid/late game, but Elspeth, Sun's Champion also gives me a wrath. This means if my opponent top decks a fatty and can get around counterspells or spot removal, and I've already exhausted my Anger of the Gods and Supreme Verdict , I can still control the board. With the loss of Snapcaster Mage in standard, I lose a way to recast a wrath later game. Elspeth solves this problem. She'll be 1-2x mainboard, dependent on playtesting.
September 13, 2013 8:26 a.m.
You don't care about speed in a control deck. Your win-cons are all already expensive (AEtherling , Jace, Memory Adept , etc.). Plus, the fact that she can come out and have the potential to do exactly what a hard-cast Terminus does NOW is pretty great. THEN you can just crank out tokens each turn until you win.
That's how I see it. She's almost like a Terminus that also wins you the game.
Jimhawk says... #2
That's why you play it in control, not midrange or aggro. And even then, it's certainly good enough for a midrange deck.
September 12, 2013 11:26 a.m.