Let's talk Jeskai
Standard forum
Posted on Sept. 24, 2015, 11:11 a.m. by Arvail
Jeskai's been a staple of Standard for the past year in some form or another. The archetype hasn't been utterly dominant but has demonstrate quite a lot of flexibility as the meta has changed. Now that rotation is upon us, how do you think Jeskai will adapt?
The first thing most of us have probably noted is that much of the burn used by Jeskai is rotating out. That leaves us with Exquisite Firecraft. Roast, Jeskai Charm, Wild Slash, and some other lesser options. During worlds, we saw Jacekai use soulfire grandmaster in conjunction with burn. Now that we have less of it, could we be moving towards a more midrange-centric Jeskai? Perhaps we'll see more Dragonlord Ojutai in Jeskai lists?
Thoughts? Oh, and since post-rotation Jeskai decks are the center of conversation, don't feel afraid to post your deck lists. Just don't do so in an effort to advertise it but actually partake in the conversation.
I really think jeskai flyers will not only be a thing, but a good thing. Most eldrazi and Abzan cards don't fly, so jeskai will simply soar over the competition. Thunderclap Wyvern might even see play there is a chance that jeskai Dragons or the general theme of dragons will become quite strong since having flying will become more relevant with the eldrazi in the game.
September 24, 2015 2:09 p.m.
Why should I run Thunderclap Wyvern over Thunderbreak Regent? Seems like a poor call to me. I don't think Jeskai can afford too many 4-drops. The opportunity cost is relatively high.
September 24, 2015 2:18 p.m.
I'm not saying thunderclap is better, though situaitonally it would be if you were to run cards like Skywise Teachings. Now to be fair that seems like more of an azorius flyers type of deal. I'm just putting out ideas and options. Thunderbreak is still better clearly a more general sense. Also to just clear something up, I said that thunderclap "might even see play" not that it would for sure, or even that I was telling anyone to replace it over Thunderbreak :)
September 24, 2015 2:25 p.m.
DarkAurora7 says... #6
I think I'll be playing a Jeskai Dragons deck for BFZ. You get the Lightning Strike equivalent in Draconic Roar, and it's even better with Soulfire Grand Master.
Jeskai Dragons (Post Rotation) Playtest
Standard*
SCORE: 1 | 0 COMMENTS | 34 VIEWS
September 24, 2015 2:34 p.m.
Mantis Rider was one of my favorite things to come out of Khans block. I really hope that it gets some things done this time around. The fact that it's most feared removal are gone sets it up as a really big threat. No one has mentioned Fiery Impulse yet and I wonder why. Spell Mastery is not hard to activate, and in a Jeskai tempo shell it's basically Lightning Bolt.
September 24, 2015 4:16 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #8
Jeskai will adapt for sure. Yes, Lightning Strike and Anger of the Gods are gone, but that's no reason to abandon ship! I agree that the flyer strategy is the way to go. By playing Thunderbreak Regent and Dragonlord Ojutai you can make Draconic Roar a feasible substitute for Lightning Strike sometimes being even better than Lightning Strike; bolt creature, bolt player for two mana. You can use Radiant Flames as a substitute for Anger of the Gods, I know it doesn't exile, but the upside is that you can decide how much damage to do. Cast it only using red to get rid of their scions and your Soulfire Grand Master will still live and gain a lot of life. Cast it with two colors and your Mantis Riders still live. Think of it a more versatile Anger of the Gods. Speaking of Mantis Riders, alulien is right. There are NO good instant speed removal cards for Mantis Riders anymore. Your getting in for three no matter what.
Jekai is incredibly flexible and these midrange decks can go a lot of ways. They can easily sideboard and become very controlly or very aggressive.
September 24, 2015 4:16 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #9
Fiery Impulse definitely isn't bad either capriom85! especially if your Jeskai build isn't utilizing dragons and Draconic Roar's potential isn't being maximized.
September 24, 2015 4:18 p.m.
TheDevicer, Stasis Snare is a nasty nasty card! I'd play it if I were playing this season.
Mandalorian, why not use them both?! Mantis Rider, Thunderbreak Regent, Dragonlord Ojutai, even Wingmate Roc. Plenty of activation for both Draconic Roar and Fiery Impulse with all the room for instants and sorcerers.
Radiant Flames will be in my Temur sideboard directly replacing Anger of the Gods. I like it better
September 24, 2015 9:26 p.m.
Fiery Impulse can only hit creatures, so will never be anywhere near Lightning Bolt.
As far as Jeskai goes, Mantis Rider seems to be in a good place right now, with all the X/3 removal rotating out. Thunderbreak Regent seems like it'll still be fine, some manner of Jeskai Dragons could be possible, using Dragonlord Ojutai, Silumgar's Scorn and Draconic Roar. You've also probably got the best reach between Jeskai Charm and Exquisite Firecraft.
It could go a bunch of different ways, my guess being that it'll be a bigger version of last standard's Jeskai. Less Burn, more stuff life Thunderbreak Regent and Dragonlord Ojutai.
September 25, 2015 4:16 a.m.
awphutt essentially described what I've brewed except I only run one Ojutai because money. I've got two wingmates instead and no roars or scorns.
September 25, 2015 8:35 a.m.
Interesting as far as no roars or scorns. The roars will mainly be meta dependent, and the scorns might just be too hard of the mana? Wingmate Rocs seem like they'll be good, especially if Mantis Rider is as good as it seems it will be. I haven't put any actual time into Jeskai particularly, this is all just theory crafting on my part, but Scorn may just be too good not to play.
September 25, 2015 8:45 a.m.
Mandalorian says... #15
I think Silumgar's Scorn will really depend on what kind of Jeskai deck you want to play. For example, my decklist runs 4 Soulfire Grand Masters and to make the most out of her ability I rely on more burn removal than countering. It should also be pointed out that even if you don't have a dragon in your hand Draconic Roar still does what you need by dealing 3 to a creature and therefore still functions without dragons. Silumgar's Scorn on the other hand becomes a mediocre counter without a dragon unless your opponent taps out for a spell. To make Silumgar's Scorn more efficient you would need to run dragons in higher numbers to ensure consistency. To do that a third dragon is probably needed and no one runs Sunscorch Regent so I suppose that leaves Icefall Regent which is okay in some match ups. This is why Silumgar's Scorn is really good in Esper Dragon decks because they have accesses to black and the other two good dragons Silumgar, the Drifting Death and Dragonlord Silumgar. Im just not convinced Jeskai has access to enough good dragons to make Silumgar's Scorn consistent. If your going to go for a more control type Jeskai you may be better of with Scatter to the Winds even with Thunderbreak Regent and Dragonlord Ojutai in your deck.
September 25, 2015 10:15 a.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #17
I'll be playing Jeskai Dragons post rotation. 3-4 copies each of Draconic Roar, Seeker of the Way, Soulfire Grand Master, Mantis Rider, Thunderbreak Regent, and Dragonlord Ojutai plus some number of Ojutai's Command, Brutal Expulsion, Icefall Regent, and Valorous Stance. Roast and Radiant Flames for the sideboard.
I think Jeskai will be fine. Shards have better mana though. I'm seriously considering a Jund Landfall deck.
September 25, 2015 4:13 p.m.
haysmafia1 says... #18
Jeskai Dragons (including Mantis Rider, stop this "it's not a dragon" insanity, Esper has been able to run only five dragons and consistently turn on their Silumgar's Scorns) is going to be very strong.
With fetches + new tango-lands, we can even splash for a forth color easily.
Here is my brew:
'Murica, F@^$ Yeah! Playtest
Standard*
SCORE: 2 | 5 COMMENTS | 473 VIEWS
September 29, 2015 10:15 a.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #19
I think black is definitely the best splash for Jeskai. It enables powerful removal in Crackling Doom and Foul-Tongue Invocation. Plus we get access to Kolaghan's Command, Dragonlord Kolaghan, and Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury.
September 29, 2015 11:06 a.m.
haysmafia1 says... #20
I couldn't agree more, hence why I've already brewed it up :-)
September 29, 2015 1:12 p.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #21
I'm also thinking about a Jeskai Tokens build:
Jeskai Deck Wins Playtest
Standard*
SCORE: 77 | 0 COMMENTS | 76051 VIEWS
I see some potential in Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper in Jeskai Ascendancy decks. Chaining noncreature spells then swinging in with a large, hasty land seems pretty good.
Jeskai Tokens doesn't lose a whole lot to rotation, with Stoke the Flames being the biggest hit. Raise the Alarm is easily replaced with Dragon Fodder.
What do you guys think of Jeskai Tokens?
September 29, 2015 2:07 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #22
It also loses Goblin Rabblemaster. Why no Monastery Mentors in your build?
September 29, 2015 2:17 p.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #23
I tried Monastery Mentor but I thought it was a bit too slow for a 3 drop as it doesn't do anything the turn it enters play. I didn't even like Goblin Rabblemaster in the deck.
I think I'll try Monastery Mentor again though. That card has a lot of potential here.
Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is really good in this deck.
September 29, 2015 2:43 p.m.
haysmafia1 says... #24
Tokens may be viable with the loss of Anger of the Gods & Bile Blight. The new Gideon is a must in any/all Jeskai decks, it does not compete with Thunderbreak Regent in the 4-drop slot, it is a "cheaper" 5-drop replacement for Stormbreath Dragon.
September 29, 2015 4:48 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #25
Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker is an example of something that could replace Stormbreath Dragon but Ill take Thunderbreak Regents over Gideon, Ally of Zendikar.
You can have multiple Thunderbreak Regents out at one time
It works well with Draconic Roar burn and Silumgar's Scorn counter
as if Dragonlord Ojutai wasn't already hard to get rid of, Thunderbreak Regent punishes you for it if you can.
Gideon isn't bad, especially if you have a Jeskai Token build but cannot replace Thunderbreak Regent in the decks that run them.
September 29, 2015 5:10 p.m.
ColdHeartedSith says... #26
In jeskai dragons Sarkhan is replacing Stormbreath but only being resolved and +ed to a dragon helps roar and scorn has lost its usefulness and power with only 6 real dragons in the build. I am looking at maybe playing a pair of Dragon Tempest and throwing Icefall Regent in there to maintain a close build to the original where haste thunderbreaks and ojutai and icefall might be even better and lets not forget the damage trigger on tempest. Other things I am considering are adding black via 3 mardu triple lands dropping to 3 jeskai trips and playing a delta and two mires and adding a swamp for a four color jeskai dragons that uses kolagon and silumgar and a couple foul tongue and crackling doom as well as a sorry dragons only club crux of fate. Lastly Im looking at Grixis dragons dropping white from the pic and the ramping version that is Jund Dragons capping off with dragonlord kolagan. My prob is I like Mantis rider alot. As for tokens I like 4 jace 2 chandra 4 mentor and fodder outburst just dont forget an Secure the Wastes or two.
September 30, 2015 3:10 a.m.
Mandalorian says... #27
Wow Dragon Tempest huh? I haven't really seen that card since janky player were playing the the Tokens + Battlefield Thaumaturge + Descent of the Dragons + Dragon Tempest combo.
That's definelty full on dragons. Im not sure Mantis Rider would have a home there because you will need a lot of removal and counters to delay until you can play your big stuff.
This is my friends grixis dragons deck, I think if you really wanted to you could splash white for Dragonlord Ojutai and things like that.
Grixis Dragons for BFZ standard Playtest
Standard*
SCORE: 12 | 12 COMMENTS | 1229 VIEWS
September 30, 2015 10:01 a.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #28
Mandalorian: You mean this awful janky combo deck?
Descent of the Dragons Combo Playtest
Standard
SCORE: 99 | 29 COMMENTS | 18753 VIEWS
I've gotten a few wins at FNM level events but could never pilot the deck to a 4-0 finish as it's far too inconsistent. Probably the most fun deck I've ever brewed though.
I think Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is best in Jeskai Ascendancy token decks. Thunderbreak Regent is better in tempo and midrange builds.
Is anyone else excited to use Brutal Expulsion?
September 30, 2015 11:33 a.m.
Mandalorian says... #29
Yep that's the one. A friend of mine played it, fun to watch.
Im on the fence with how I feel about Brutal Expulsion, everyone is saying its Remand + Magma Spray. My issue with that is that Remand returns a spell and draws a card, two functions, two mana. Brutal Expulsion returns a spell and Magma Sprays, two functions, 4 mana. Now that may be unfair to compare the two and that's fine but I feel that its a playable card at three mana, not four. Ojutai's Command takes the 4cmc slot for me.
September 30, 2015 12:20 p.m.
Gorgosaurusrex says... #30
I think I'll be running a 2/2 split of Ojutai's Command and Brutal Expulsion in midrange builds. Expulsion doesn't offer a real two-for-one (as the spell is bounced) but it can be a huge tempo play. Bouncing the opponent's Siege Rhino as it's being cast while exiling a Den Protector seems pretty good to me.
September 30, 2015 1:10 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #31
Ill be keeping an eye out to see how it plays before experimenting myself.
September 30, 2015 3:02 p.m.
Mandalorian says... #32
So what did everyone think of all the Jeskai in the Pro Tour?
alulien says... #2
All I know is that Mantis Rider is really well positioned right now. No more Bile Blight or Lightning Strike? It evades Roast? It forces the opponent to waste "big" removal (a la Exquisite Firecraft or Ruinous Path, etc.) AND it flies. I'm a little concerned with what it's going to do...
(As Abzan) I'm hoping that a package of Transgress the Mind and Abzan Charm will be what I need to deal with it...
September 24, 2015 11:43 a.m.