whats even being played in standard?
Standard forum
Posted on Feb. 19, 2014, 3:01 p.m. by Dridane
Whats being played in standard and whats strong at the moment?? Just wondering before I go back to FNM for the first time in a while and bring my selesnya heroic deck im not sure how ill fare. Lol
gnarlicide says... #4
well, over here in N.C., turn 1 at FNM looks alot like this.
A.) Play swamp (or equivalent shock), cast Thoughtseize
or B.) Play island (or equivalent shock), cast Cloudfin Raptor
those are your options. I feel like standard looks worse than UW Delver Pike from a couple years ago.
February 19, 2014 4:03 p.m.
@ gnarlicide i think that's almost everywhere. I don't go to FNM due to working a second shift job and Fridays are my equivalent to monday.(enter MTGO) but looking at my lgs FB page seems that way here in Ga too
February 19, 2014 4:26 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #6
valamar, I have not played standard since before christmas. I thought BNG would have brought us some more to work with, but alas, nope.
I don't have a PC, so mtgo is out of the question. I just play modern now.
February 19, 2014 4:30 p.m.
gnarlicide FTR t1 Thoughtseize is usually a misplay, it's t2 you want to ts, for the most information.
February 19, 2014 5:24 p.m.
I know at my LGS we have a couple of heavy Mono B players intersperced with U/W/x Control players. I play R/W devotion so I really don't care as long as I barf creatures onto the board.
February 19, 2014 5:38 p.m.
gufymike, not if you have another Thoughtseize or a Pack Rat in hand, which is most of the time. Discard into pack rat is commonly excepted as an awesome start.
February 19, 2014 5:40 p.m.
Blakkhand, if you have a Pack Rat
, you don't want to play him turn 2 most of the time, unless against an aggro match up. He's a mid to late game play for the most value. Anyways, I did say, 'most of the time'. On the draw, t1 might also be acceptable, on the play, never t1 it unless against an known aggro deck that can spit out the hand quickly.
February 19, 2014 5:42 p.m.
"Thoughtseize
into Pack Rat
is and always was the best thing to do in Standard"
- Owen Turtenwald, the currently acknowledged best Mono B player. ;)
February 19, 2014 5:53 p.m.
I disagree, it depends on the matchup, because d-sphere turn 3 will have you digging for another Pack Rat . Removal is there, but I like to play around it and maximize the value of the Pack Rat . And I can disagree, I'm not a sheep that listens to everything I hear/read/see, I make my own observations and testing and plays. He also has called the whip unnecessary. But walking away from that article, you're unclear as to why it's a bad call, only he doesn't use it. I don't disagree with this information, because I find the whip to be 'win more', but outside of mono-b, like b/w midrange, the whip is perfect for it.
February 19, 2014 5:59 p.m.
Dalektable says... #14
I'm really grateful i have a more diverse meta at my shop than some of you unlucky folks. Sure, there are a few people (including the shop owner) running MBD and some playing MUD, and a couple play U/W/x control. But for the most part my shop is pretty diverse and i see a lot of variety of decks. I run a rogue-ish white weenies deck that does fairly well, and a few other really nice home brews too. That's why i like my shop, it's not an entire shop of net deckers but at the same time a lot of these people arent anything to scoff at, a few have played in pro tours and such and many go to qualifiers and do well.
February 19, 2014 6:07 p.m.
Of course it depends on the MU, but you said that it's usually wrong to T1 a thoughtseize, while in actuality it is generally correct in Mono B (with the assumption that you have a T2 play). Also, even against UW, I'm generally fine with TS into Pack rat, as it forces them to top deck in the next four draws or they just lose; it's even pretty low cost considering there's so much dead removal in the deck.
Also, just because I'm not arrogant enough to think I'm better than the pros doesn't make me a sheep, which is what you implied. I respect results more than hearsay, and Owen has results, you have hearsay.
February 19, 2014 6:28 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #16
gufymike, while I agree with you that in standard a t2 or t3 thought seize, depending on what you are against is the best play in the situation, it still does not change the fact that people dont puke out a t1 thought seize when it is in their opening hand.
It happens more often than I would like to accept. I would even go as far as saying that it is the new norm.
February 19, 2014 7:07 p.m.
Blakkhand That's you, I'm not. and u/w doesn't top deck, it gets what it needs when it needs it. I'm also going to say, you can do what you want. I don't play the ways the pros play, because I play the way I play and what fits me best. I don't have results in mono-b because I haven't played it in a tournament yet, playtesting against the gauntlet, working out strategy, I do have. I also have experience with ts outside of std and t1 ts was always a mistake, unless in legacy.
You can listen to them and I suggest you do, but I do highly suggest you don't take their word for it, you find the truth out for yourself. I don't get into name calling directly or indirectly and if you feel insulted, that's on you. You need to read me as saying what I have done and do without relation to your situation. You making it come across as I care that much about your situation. I don't really. I don't even care if you experiment or work out the facts for yourself, but don't just quote someone without actually knowing for a fact it's the best/proper thing to do to me without expecting a similar response. If I haven't playtested or worked it out or done things with it, then I won't speak on it like I know what I'm talking about.
gnarlicide I know the feels.
February 19, 2014 7:28 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #18
Although, I would say that I play TS on T1 in modern depending on what I am playing against. Usually I do it in game 1 to get a good idea of what I need to work with. Modern can get just as crazy as legacy if you're not paying attention. I also understand that there are players like me that play specific cards to trick people into thinking I am playing a different deck. So I TS accordingly to get a better idea. Along with the idea that disrupting the first couple turns in modern, (turn 2 being the most crucial) can make or break a game.
tl;dr, I do it in modern. too much is at stake.
February 19, 2014 8:02 p.m.
To much life loss t1 for my tastes, that could be 5 points of damage against rdw, pod, soul sisters, b/w tokens, merfolk, affinity, zoo or jund that can be two too many. I agree there is a need to know what's going on and life is a resource, But i've lost too many matches and games to that t1 ts, where I could have stabilized and won without the life loss t1. Though I will take the chance on the draw, never on the play unless I know the match up is zoo or similar where they can drop lethal turn 2.
Though recently I've moved to u/w/r control in modern, where it's a non issue for me to worry about it, but I love Dispel ling or Mana Leak ing it :P
February 19, 2014 8:19 p.m.
gnarlicide says... #20
Fair enough. I am a Jund player. The loss of life is nerve racking, which is why I run a 3/3 split between TS and inquisition. If I can IoK on turn 1, I will. On the play, I usually wait for the next turn, much like you. On the draw, I feel like there is no choice. I can usually stabilize after I get my lands in order or if I draw Kitchen Finks and Scavenging Ooze . They help a lot.
I guess it's just a matter of preference.
February 19, 2014 8:32 p.m.
If you believe in T2-3 based on experience that's fine. Some people value life/information more than mana efficiency. I prefer the latter.
February 20, 2014 3:39 p.m.
Where I play there is a good mix of brews, aggro/blitz decks, midrange and the normal tire 1 MBD/MUD, U/W/x control.
InconspicuousPotato says... #2
Mono-Black Devotion and U/W/x control are some big ones. G/R monsters are doing well too. Look at this link for some idea of the meta.
February 19, 2014 3:05 p.m.