Who else thinks that Pack Rat is overrated?
Standard forum
Posted on Jan. 29, 2014, 5:45 a.m. by ChrisHansonBiomancin
Let me start with this caveat- in a deck with a dedicated graveyard theme, Pack Rat can be fantastic. However, his main use currently seems to be in MBD, which only runs a couple Whip of Erebos if any. I have noticed that most of the players at my LGS who play MBD have dropped the Rat from their list, as have many Pro decks, but it seems to get plenty of love here on T/O. I honestly think it is very weak in many popular matchups; here's a brief explanation for some of those:
MUD: Too slow. The flyers go right over him, and Frostburn Weird isn't fazed. If you spend your early turns making Rats, it means you're not killing their creatures (Thassa, God of the Sea will thank you) or putting out flyers of your own.
RDW: Again, too slow. First off, every burn in their deck can handle him on turn 2. And they'll gladly trade a Burning-Tree Emissary or Rakdos Cackler for him early on. Spend too much time making Rats instead of killing their Devotion dudes, and Fanatic of Mogis will make you pay.
Selesnya: Another aggro matchup in which Pack Rat can't keep up. They have efficient, big bodies that stay ahead of the curve (ex. Fleecemane Lion ) while Pack Rat is a step behind the curve; while you're making a 2/2 Rat on turn 3, they're playing Loxodon Smiter . And they'd love to trade a Rat with Voice of Resurgence or even Soldier of the Pantheon .
MGD / GR Monsters: You can't afford to be dilly-dallying with Rat tokens early on; you have to slow down their ramp, or Polukranos, World Eater will eat them up, Stormbreath Dragon will fly over them, and Garruk, Caller of Beasts will supply an endless stream of chump blockers and fatties. Like Selesnya, they have no problem staying ahead of the curve. You also have to watch out for Mizzium Mortars as early as turn 4.
Mirror Match: This might have been a feasible matchup pre-BNG, but say hello to Bile Blight .
Esper / UW control: Probably Pack Rat's worst matchups. They would love nothing more than to have you throw away cards to make Rats before they drop Detention Sphere or Supreme Verdict .
@Schuesseled: agreed, I don't see t2 rat as a good play against aggro at all. In fact, I think its a terrible play, unless you dropped Mutavault and/or have more rats in hand to back him up should he be killed.
January 29, 2014 6:14 p.m.
I think we can all agree that early pack rat is a BAD play.
January 29, 2014 6:15 p.m.
ChrisHansonBiomancin says... #4
Since much of MBD's removal is in the 3-drop slot, and the rest of their creatures start there, it is oftentimes better to play it t2 against aggro if you don't have other plays, even if you're not going to make Rat tokens in subsequent turns. At the very worst, they spend a turn removing it which gives you time to catch up. If not, you won't have to spend the extra 2 mana to get him started when you do stabilize. And yes, kmcree, in Pro tournaments, you have access to your opponent's deck list before games.
That all said, the fact that it is such a bad t2 play and ideally a finisher is one of the reasons why I think it's overrated. Other finishers don't require you to ditch cards to make it so, and don't require as much of a mana investment even if Pack Rat is technically a 2-drop. Sure, having a Rat improves your late game draws, but if the creature you play is already a threat by itself, you don't have to decide between discarding a potentially useful card and making another Rat just to turn the orginal into a viable threat.
January 29, 2014 6:31 p.m.
ChrisHansonBiomancin says... #5
I will mention that many of the MBD's at my LGS that have dropped Pack Rat have done so when splashing another color. Currently, Mono Black doesn't have many great replacements, but as BNG and Journey into Nyx make two color decks more playable, I predict that the Rats will be one of the first to get the boot when splashing becomes more popular among the Pros.
January 29, 2014 6:38 p.m.
I wouldn't necessarily look at pack rat as forcing you to ditch cards. I would look at it as making bad draws better. For example, late game, you have 5-7 lands out, the last thing you need is more land. But, statistically speaking, you'll still draw more land roughly 1/3 of the time. So all those land draws now become rats. I just think you're looking at that aspect the wrong way.
As far as comparisons to other finishers, lets compare him to, for example, Blood Baron of Vizkopa . Baron comes in t5 at the earliest. So, if you play a rat t5, you use 2 mana, have 3 left over to either make another rat or play something else (Hero's Downfall to remove a big threat maybe). Neither can attack until the next turn. Now, assuming you dropped a mutavault at some point, your rat is either a 2/2 or 3/3 if you dropped a token with him. t6 you drop a couple more tokens and you're swinging with potentially 2 5/5s that are going to continue to get bigger, and, for lack of a better word, proliferate. Next turn you've got 4 5/5's, or bigger if you drop more tokens. That can wreck a game much faster than the baron. Now the baron has the lifelink to stabilize, but this just gives you an idea of the rat's potential.
January 29, 2014 6:42 p.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #7
Came into this expecting the OP to be trolling, leaving the thread with a headache.
January 29, 2014 8:22 p.m.
ChrisHansonBiomancin says... #8
@kmcree: I see your point about turning unneeded lands into Rats, but that still leaves 60% of your draws that will be spells that you must now choose between using and tossing. Essentially, that means that if you make four tokens over the course of a couple turns as in the scenario above, there's a good chance that 2 or 3 of them will be kill spells, Desecration Demon , etc. Both Pack Rat and Blood Baron of Vizkopa are tougher to answer than the average creature, but at least with BBoV if he is answered, you are not out those additional cards. And any creatures that you didn't throw away to him (or blockers/counterattackers that can be cleared out with saved kill spells) have to be considered as well when you're looking at how fast BBoV closes out the game.
January 29, 2014 8:41 p.m.
ChrisHansonBiomancin Erebos, God of the Dead is sideboard tech.
kmcree says... #1
I would still argue that a t2 rat could still be a misplay, even if G/W doesn't have an answer, for the simple fact that some sort of removal could probably have been more effective. I don't have an hour to watch the clip, so I'm not sure what the exact board state or cards in hand looked like, but if pack rat is one of my main threats, and I know he takes a couple turns to get going, I'm not going to throw him out to the wolves t2 before I can protect him. G/W could also have fight mechanic based removal (like Pit Fight ) or something else. Unless he knew his opponents entire deck and sideboard, t2 rat seems like a very reckless play. Unless, of course, he was holding a second rat in hand. Regardless, I think the rat is a very strong card. You yourself admitted that he pretty much invented MBD, and the rats obviously featured very heavily in his deck. And, again, its a 4x in pretty much every competitive standard MBD deck, so I'm still not really sure how you can argue he isn't very good.
January 29, 2014 6:12 p.m.