Why Rattleclaw Mystic is not seeing play
Standard forum
Posted on Oct. 7, 2014, 1:53 p.m. by xGhostx
There is one very quick, and solid reason for this. Sylvan Caryatid is infinitely better all around. Sure the Mystic can produce 3 mana when morphed but your still taking at least 1-2 turns longer to do this then the instant impact Caryatid has.
Sylvan Caryatid is very solid Aggro defense, arguably one of the best mana dorks since BoP and if any deck is currently running green and does not have Caryatid in their build, they are doing it wrong, plain and simple. Alot of people talk about how Courser of Kruphix is a Green staple in Standard at the moment and easily the best playable green creature, my argument is always Courser is good, but Caryatid wins.
From a financial standpoint, if you have em hold em, at least for now. The only way mine leave is if I am offered well above face. I do not think this card has peaked yet.
For Rattleclaw Mystic hold off on your picking him up. He will drop. When he does scoop him up. Before rotation, Mystic's price will spike, on the levels of the Goblin Rabblemaster spike. Once Caryatid is gone Mystic will be the staple replacement.
1) we've barely seen any competitive khans
2) Rattleclaw Mystic serves a different purpose to the caryatid. Caryatid is defensive. Rattleclaw can dish out some beats. So caryatid is NOT infinitely better in every way - it just fits into what green wants to do right now. Apples, oranges.
October 7, 2014 2:05 p.m.
Fair enough :)
For Sylvan Caryatid having a low price, where are you buying them and at what price? Because if its under $10 I will scoop up the lot just tell me where to send all my ruppees to lol.
SCG has them listed at $15 and my LGS are selling that $18-$20 due to the demand and trades are fetching more then then that in worth from people that require them.
I agree with your Rattleclaw Mystic spike statement, I may have been jumping the gun on that one. Yes he may not see a Rabblemaster spike, but I think he will go from $2-$3 rare where he will drop to soon, to easily $10 slightly before Theros rotates out, which I would consider a solid spike and a good investment if scooped at the right time. All I know is, right now I am hording Caryatid's and dumping Mystics :P
October 7, 2014 2:07 p.m.
ChiefBell I hear what your saying, but I just do not think he is utility enough to fit into that role. The beats can come from so many other places in RUG that I just dont think Rattleclaw Mystic will take that 2drop spot from Sylvan Caryatid
Again, my personal thoughts.
October 7, 2014 2:10 p.m.
I don't think the time is right for the mystic, but my point is that he does do something different to caryatid.
I wouldn't bother long term investing in the caryatid though. Both of those cards are kinda lame in modern etc. Look for the quick buy / sell.
October 7, 2014 2:11 p.m.
Agreed ChiefBell, I was hitting more along the lines of I do not think that Caryatid has hit her ceiling yet, so I am still picking them up where available, if the price is right. I think soon she will start to see a steady drop in price, then plummet as Theros gets close to rotation. She still has a solid 6-8 months of rising in the stocks before she starts to drop I think. I will continue to horde then dump mid/late summer. Unless she just hits insane value before then.
October 7, 2014 2:16 p.m.
Sylvan Caryatid is ~$15? Wtf? I put one I pulled in a booster pack in my Animar, Soul of Elements deck since I don't play standard. Maybe I should think about trading it...
October 7, 2014 2:56 p.m.
Rob_the_Taavi says... #10
Rattleclaw Mystic
Cab be played in any deck tho......No colored Mana investment means versatility. Maybe even longevity. It's not unheard of for certain formats to have 
on turn 1. Also, it taps for 
and you can play Lighting Bolt for a . Wanna know what kinds of competitive decks play and Lighting Bolt? Almost all of them. Especially the ones that play Snapcaster Mage
.
October 7, 2014 3:31 p.m.
Very strong point I never really took the time to step back look at the potential of the Mystic running in builds not utilizing Green.
Places this entire topic in a new light.
October 7, 2014 3:35 p.m.
I agree that Caryatid is shadowing Mystic big time. Also, Mystic only accelerates RUG, where Caryatid does it all. Just a better card all around. TEMUR will use him when Caryatid goes away, but just not on the same level.
October 7, 2014 3:37 p.m.
Nigeltastic says... #13
That's horrible logic. By that thought, all modern decks should run Simian Spirit Guide
because it makes for free and that lets them cast Lightning Bolt
.
October 7, 2014 3:41 p.m.
CommanderOfBolas says... #14
I might revise my statement as I do not play green, I don't keep up with the prices of green cards. Last I checked, caryatid was $7 at my shop, but I haven't checked in a while
October 7, 2014 4:31 p.m.
Rattleclaw Mystic is better for explosive plays, that is where it shines over its hexproof predecessor (spelling).
land + Elvish Mystic >> land + Rattleclaw Mystic morphed >> land + Savage Knuckleblade with haste. swing for 6 on turn 3.
caryatid cannot provide that much umph. we have yet to see what else the rest of the block will bring, but yes in the above mentioned strategy, mighty morphing power ranger earns his keep
October 7, 2014 4:36 p.m.
The way I see it, you can morph a Rattleclaw Mystic , and the very next turn flip him over and tap him to summon a Kiora, the Crashing Wave for 2 mana. That's value.
October 7, 2014 5:19 p.m.
Khanye you don't need the Rattleclaw Mystic to pull off your scenario. Turn 1 Yavimaya Coast and Elvish Mystic ... turn 2 Temple of Abandon and Heir of the Wilds (or any other 2 power creature) .... turn 3 Shivan Reef (tap elvish mystic, coast and reef) Savage Knuckleblade (tap temple for haste) and attack with your turn knuckleblade and your Heir of the Wilds for 6! Didn't need the Rattleclaw Mystic for any umph and you have a 4/4 and a 2/2 deathtoucher.
Also, your scenario doesn't even require the Rattleclaw Mystic to even be morphed. When you untap and play a land on turn 3 you'll have 4 mana available in your scenario because of turn 1 elf. You can tap your elf and lands to cast knuckleblade and give it haste and attack with it and the rattleclaw just like in the scenario I described. In your scenario if you were to morph the rattleclaw after playing a land then it does nothing for you. After playing a land and morphing the rattleclaw you'll have 6 mana available. It cost 3 to cast the knuckleblade and 1 to give it haste so you'll only have 2 mana available so you won't be able to pump it and will be forced to attack with the rattleclaw if you want to swing for 6 like you said (which could have been done without morphing it or even playing it face down in the first place)
I guess you were technically correct, the caryatid can't do that much on turn 3 because it can't attack. But your swinging for 6 on turn 3 is in no way fueled by the raw power of the Rattleclaw Mystic
like you seem to think it is. However playing the caryatid turn 2 will make it more likely that you'll have the GUr to cast knuckleblade on turn 3 and have an extra r available to give it haste. In your scenario it's very possible that you'll have to tap your rattleclaw for the extra and will only be swinging for 4 anyways.
October 7, 2014 6:24 p.m.
Khanye you don't need the Rattleclaw Mystic to pull off your scenario. Turn 1 Yavimaya Coast and Elvish Mystic ... turn 2 Temple of Abandon and Heir of the Wilds (or any other 2 power creature) .... turn 3 Shivan Reef (tap elvish mystic, coast and reef) Savage Knuckleblade (tap temple for haste) and attack with your turn knuckleblade and your Heir of the Wilds for 6! Didn't need the Rattleclaw Mystic for any umph and you have a 4/4 and a 2/2 deathtoucher.
Also, your scenario doesn't even require the Rattleclaw Mystic to even be morphed. When you untap and play a land on turn 3 you'll have 4 mana available in your scenario because of turn 1 elf. You can tap your elf and lands to cast knuckleblade and give it haste and attack with it and the rattleclaw just like in the scenario I described. In your scenario if you were to morph the rattleclaw after playing a land then it does nothing for you. After playing a land and morphing the rattleclaw you'll have 6 mana available. It cost 3 to cast the knuckleblade and 1 to give it haste so you'll only have 2 mana available so you won't be able to pump it and will be forced to attack with the rattleclaw if you want to swing for 6 like you said (which could have been done without morphing it or even playing it face down in the first place)
I guess you were technically correct, the caryatid can't do that much on turn 3 because it can't attack. But your swinging for 6 on turn 3 is in no way fueled by the raw power of the Rattleclaw Mystic
like you seem to think it is. However playing the caryatid turn 2 will make it more likely that you'll have the GU to cast knuckleblade on turn 3 and have an extra available to give it haste. In your scenario it's very possible that you'll have to tap your rattleclaw for the extra and will only be swinging for 4 anyways.
October 7, 2014 6:24 p.m.
actually the heir + knuckle swings for 7! but ya...rattleclaw functions more of an aggro set than stable ramp.
October 7, 2014 6:42 p.m.
Really digging the direction this thread has gone in :) all very solid points on the strengths of each and where they shine.
October 7, 2014 6:50 p.m.
haha, don't know why but that was the first green two drop that popped in my head, I wasn't even thinking about the ferocious. See your better off without the rattleclaw lol.
October 7, 2014 7:25 p.m.
JexInfinite says... #23
I think Rattleclaw will definitely see play in aggressive green decks, whereas Caryatid sees play in slower, more defensive lists.
CommanderOfBolas says... #2
I agree with most of what you said, except about the price spike of Rattleclaw Mystic when caryatid rotates. For starters, Caryatid has been the only mana dork really worth playing other than Elvish Mystic , and he doesn't have a huge pricetag. Why would a worse card have a higher price? Second, maybe he will be the go to, or maybe something will be printed that is better. Lastly, if he does see a price spike, it will be because he is only worth $3 and he goes back to his current $7 price tag. Rabblemaster went from 2 all the way to 20, and will probably go up to 30 in the near future. I highly doubt a mana drk will ever get that high (obviously excluding Noble Hierarch )
October 7, 2014 2:01 p.m.