views and the guys that dont comment
TappedOut forum
Posted on Dec. 26, 2013, 11 p.m. by flinx
i have a deck posted for standard that i have asked for help with, or at least comments to help me improve it or criticisms, it has shown over 140 views, yet not a single comment, if you dont like the deck please say something, if you do , tell me what you like about it. heres what i have to say overall, be it me or another poster on here, comment , take the time you would like people to take with your decks and give your opinion. otherwise your just showing posting decks on this site is useless . help players out. if you feel the same way i do, then please post your decks, and post links to other decks you think people can help with
Epochalyptik says... #3
Moved to TappedOut forum (since this pertains to the site).
I wouldn't be so quick to criticize. If I look at a deck, but have nothing helpful to say, I don't bother commenting because the comment would be meaningless. I suspect a lot of views come from people who are interested in seeing what the deck is about, but who also don't have anything to suggest.
December 26, 2013 11:08 p.m.
thanks for the move, i figured it would be under general. but otherwise im not criticizing, im just saying that with a lot of views, someone should have something to say, and if you plus one a why should be welcome, the only time i view and dont comment is if someone has already commented on what i planned on saying, and if i plus one i always comment. i like to let people know why i plus one. not for the other viewers so i have accolades, but so the builder knows why i liked it. i may be a bit of an upstart here, but i like to think i have some useful feedback. im just saying that a highly viewed deck should at least have a few comments. if you view a deck and you dont like it, tell the builder why, and if you like then, then the opposite. if you have ideas for improvements, then say something. this is a social site for magic lovers, so enter in the discussion, i for one will never turn down constructive criticism. talk to me or any other builder out there that shares his builds
December 26, 2013 11:14 p.m.
Simple answer. Nobody cares. If I see a deck where I feel obligated to actually go out of my way to make a comment on it I will however I don't feel any obligation to just comment on every random deck I see, especially since the vast majority of the decks on this site aren't worth looking at...
December 26, 2013 11:20 p.m.
then i pose this query. why be one here at all? if your so certain of your ability why post anything other than as a reason to gloat? i for one am here to improve my play style and help others to improve theirs to help evolve the game. i love it for all aspects, the different formats, the different play styles, and the weird and wacky ideas that one up. if you dont care then why look? of you see a 60 card deck that has no consistency no matter what format, what prevents you from taking 30 sec to say hey, why not sac a one of and use three of this or that? this is a community of friends and lovers of the game. you see some of the top competitors of distinct formats posting their builds, they're not looking for accolades, but to get critiques and help them improve. do the same for others, thats all i ask, and that is what i will strive to do.
December 26, 2013 11:29 p.m.
ShadowLand says... #7
Sure thing, this thread has hit a point, if I see a deck that is all over the place, or running a 1-of a great card, I at least ask them why.
December 26, 2013 11:54 p.m.
I'm here to keep track of my decks and cube. I do happen to comment or offer advice if I happen to feel like it. You're pretty self-entitled to be complaining that people aren't going out of their way to comment and give you advice on every single thing you post when they don't care.
December 27, 2013 12:31 a.m.
Metroid_Hybrid says... #9
Or how about when someone comments that they like your deck, but doesn't say why or give a +1.. That gets pretty old too..
But I feel your pain.. I've been trying to get some constructive sideboard advice on a W/R Heroic deck before I take it out to my first 'Standard' FNM since Innistrad/M13 rotated out, so I don't just show up to be a lamb to slaughter..
Heroic Shenanigans Win.. if anyone is interested.. :D
December 27, 2013 12:35 a.m.
I agree witht he comment above me. This post makes you come off as if you feel very self entitled. I look at a lot of decks and don't have any opinion or interest in it. It might have had an interesting name, or an interesting idea, but not actually been something I wanted to look at and or suggest. Maybe I didn't have anything to suggest or on some of the worst, obviously budget decks, simply didn't think it was worth suggesting expensive cards that they would never want to add. There are a lot of decks on here and sometimes I just don't want to comment on it. Maybe try adding some things you'd like help with to the description and see if that helps. Just don't expect people to automatically comment on your decks.
December 27, 2013 12:41 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #11
In OP's defense, it is sometimes frustrating to see that your decks are getting views and upvotes, but nobody is commenting. Usually, it's only "bad" when you feel as though you need help improving a deck, and you're waiting for a response, but nobody is chiming in.
December 27, 2013 12:46 a.m.
I looked at the deck, which I assume is the one called "Grope," to see if I could see the problem. For a start the name doesn't seem to have anything to do with the deck. People might be looking for the name, (Although I don't know why they're searching Grope). The main reason I think no one is suggesting anything is because you specifically said you only want to use Theros cards. In your colours, with your style of deck there isn't a huge selection of changes you could make just with Theros cards. I think thats probably a large part of why a lot of people aren't commenting. The other thing is that the deck is kind of all over the place and without RTR cards this isn't really going to improve. If you want to make a competitive FNM deck you're not going to be able to just use Theros. Sorry if this was a bit long, but I'm trying to show you why people might not comment.
December 27, 2013 12:59 a.m.
I wish that everybody on the site would post constructive criticism on each of my decks, but I also understand that sometimes people just don't care. I also tend to play fairly unoriginal decks which makes it especially hard to get attention.
On the other hand, I often find that I get enticed by an interesting deck name, only to click on it and see that it is an entirely boring and poorly thought out deck. Other times I just don't have anything good to say, like Epoch said.
December 27, 2013 4:19 a.m.
Triforce-Finder says... #15
I hear you. So many decks, so few comments. It's frustrating sometimes.
Something I often have trouble with is a missing description. When I see a deck that seems interesting, I often don't comment because I can't see what thoughts have been put into the deck before, or because I'm too lazy to figure the strategy and key moves out by myself.
Long story short, If I'm supposed to help someone with a deck, I need to know how (s)he wants to play it, what it's supposed to do. So a description, even a short and simple one, helps you a lot, not only in getting comments, but also in getting useful comments. Overboarding descriptions on the other hand suggest that there is not much to improve, so handle with care.
Make the first sentence a short summary of the deck, that will keep people who are interested in that concept from zapping over to the next one.
State clearly what you need help on: mana, stability, speed, etc. That way, even those who don't want to dig into the deck too deeply can give some suggestions for that area.
People will often only improve a deck when they like it, when they can see themselves playing a better version of it. Make people like your deck. Sell it.
Use design to make your deck easy to understand. Group cards by their use, explain them in chronological order, by importance or something like that. Look at this one, its easily comprehended in a minute, and I almost instantly got a useful suggestion. After 5 cycles or so...
Bouncing Birds (feedback welcome)
One thing is important, though: Patience. You sometimes will have to cycle your deck more than 10 times to get even a single comment. Don't be deceived by the view counter, because it counts your own views and all refreshes etc. too, so the views are sometimes not even a tenth of what it shows.
If all else fails, find a similar deck and ask the person that built it for help directly. All they can do is say nope...
December 27, 2013 9:17 a.m.
Two things to add to the conversation. First of all, 140 views is actually quite a small amount on this site. You may not hit comments until 1000 views.
Secondly, I personally use this site as a playtester when I am building a competitive deck. You my get views from people looking to test their deck against various archetypes, without any intention of helping you personally. When I was doing that, I would only comment or +1 decks that beat me, which was only like 1 for every 3 or 4.
December 27, 2013 10:11 a.m.
There are many uses for posting decks here:
- People you play with in RL can tailor their decks against yours and not be surprised by what you play anymore
- You can have a paper trail / track record of your own ideas and how they developed over time (or accidentally get mistaken for being a blatant net-decker)
- You can make the computer do your sorting by color and CMC instead of doing it yourself
- Any misconceptions you may have could get caught before making a similar mistake at the LGS
- You can entertain your friends with your choice comments and associated pictures / music in your deck description.
- You can keep your decklists on an online site where you can check it / share it in RL with people from any computer anywhere any time.
- You can get a few comments sometimes that may or may not prove helpful
In reference to the point about making comments: I find that sometimes making comments on other peoples' decks leads to reciprocal comments - and that sometimes I get a few comments from the people whose decks I link in my own deck description because I thought they were similar.
I haven't gotten comments for some time but I also haven't done many Theros related updates or added any new decks, really. It could also possibly a general slow-down in comments, though? It's hard to tell!
December 27, 2013 10:17 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #18
Triforce-Finder makes a good point. The description plays a large role in whether people understand your deck or know what kind of help you want. We try to encourage people to be specific in their deck descriptions and in their Deck Help forum posts because detail in those places does get you more results down the line. Unfortunately, most people stick to single-sentence descriptions and deck link posts, and they receive little help in return.
I covered this concept in moderate length in my article, Getting More Views on Your Decks. You may want to read it.
December 27, 2013 11:31 a.m.
to make something clear here, i would like comments, but i was using the one standard deck i have that has potential as an example. im not sitting here whining about why people aren't critiquing my deck or why people aren't telling me what a wonderful job im dong or how bad i sick so i can whine about them later. it was just an example. i noticed that the majority of decks i was looking at had a lot of views but no comments. my deck was an example. after being active on here for only a few days i didn't expect my decks to be high on comments. i do appreciate all the attention this thread has gotten the one deck i described (and my gods the advice has been great!!!!!!!!!!) but im just talking overall. if you ignore me but make the average deck commenting meter on here 1 or greater i am happy. im a hobbyist, not a competitor, meaning that i want to see people talking and helping each other, if i came across as arrogant and self serving i apologize and i invite everyone who thinks so to ignore my future posts. i just want to see the little guy that has a few views get a comment to help him out, and ig he gets a plus one, why that happened. i didnt mean to come across as self serving and i apologize. but other than that my message stands. if you view a deck, give the owner a bit of advice unless its already been given. good example here in a purely hypothetical. i saw a deck that had 30+ comments. other than a single card suggestions it all said good deck. awesome, the guy built a good deck. i saw another deck that had several hundred views and 0 comments. out of all of them why could someone have said, hey , dude, you have 85 cards for a standard deck and other than the 25 basic lands none of them are the same, how about a little reliability by making it 60 cards and 2 or three of each card?" no one said anything and just passed them by. i say help a player out and take the ten sec to offer the basics, even if its just a link to a basic deck building site. anyway i wanted to thank everyone thats viewed this thread and posted. you all are wonderful, even my critics! youve all made me think about what i post here and i appreciate it.
December 29, 2013 2:47 a.m.
shinobigarth says... #20
a lot of my decks dont get many comments either, but then i usually dont write up much description in terms of what each card is there for or whatever. i generally cant be bothered to explain why i chose each card, so if in return others cant be bothered to comment on it, i guess thats fair.
on the other hand sometimes you explain what you want the deck to do and ask for suggestions on cards that might be a BETTER choice than ones you have, you just either forgot about them or arent aware of them. it is frustrating sometimes when someone could make a quick 5 second suggestion and they dont.
December 29, 2013 4:21 a.m.
I typically only view or comment on decks I am looking specifically for or if it happens to be similar to mine and if theres no description like the other guys say forget it I stop looking and move on. I will +1 on a deck if theres something about it I like. If I learn something from your deck then that's how I show the owner. I have some decks that I have cycled a bunch of times and have several thousand views with very little useful feedback while I have some other decks that exploded with comments and attention. Thats just the name of the game dude.
December 29, 2013 8:45 a.m.
shinobigarth says... #22
ive also noticed not many people like tribal, and since i do a lot of tribal, those decks usually dont get commented on. i've just learned to deal with it i guess.
flinx says... #2
and if you give a plus one then tell the person why!
December 26, 2013 11:01 p.m.