Can I sacrifice my Wurmcoil Engine then it's two tokens to Kuldotha Forgemaster to search for an artifact?
Asked by IPyro92 13 years ago
Can I sacrifice my Wurmcoil Engine and then sacrifice the two tokens it creates to satisfy the 3 creatures Kuldotha Forgemaster requires for his ability?
djdauenbaugh says... #2
user:crazykillsftw is correct. In order to "activate" Kuldotha Forgemaster the cost(everything to the left of the colon) must be paid in order to add it's ability to the stack. If Wurmcoil Engine is one of them, it will go to the graveyard and its ability will then trigger, being activated on the stack. I believe that as the rules below state, you must have three artifacts to sacrifice already on the field in order to even add Kuldotha Forgemaster 's ability to the stack, otherwise it's considered "illegal". I think based on my understanding of the rules below this is how it works.
602.2. To activate an ability is to put it onto the stack and pay its costs, so that it will eventually resolve and have its effect. Only an objects controller (or its owner, if it doesnt have a controller) can activate its activated ability unless the object specifically says otherwise. Activating an ability follows the steps listed below, in order. If, at any point during the activation of an ability, a player is unable to comply with any of those steps, the activation is illegal; the game returns to the moment before that ability started to be activated (see rule 715, Handling Illegal Actions). Announcements and payments cant be altered after theyve been made.
602.2a The player announces that he or she is activating the ability. If an activated ability is being activated from a hidden zone, the card that has that ability is revealed. That ability is created on the stack as an object thats not a card. It becomes the topmost object on the stack. It has the text of the ability that created it, and no other characteristics. Its controller is the player who activated the ability. The ability remains on the stack until its countered, it resolves, or an effect moves it elsewhere.
Just an idea-Precursor Golem might be a better idea to trigger Kuldotha Forgemaster with.
I'm not 100% sure of the order of the stack, because it's possible that as you start to pay the casting cost, the Wurmcoil Engine 's ability will be added to the top of the stack, then resolve and two more artifacts are now in play, then sacrifice them, meaning the cost is met, and then Kuldotha Forgemaster can resolve, but I think I'm right. If someone else can clear this up for us, it would be greatly appreciated!
February 1, 2011 2:06 p.m.
thaimaishuu says... #3
601.2g The player pays the total cost in any order. Partial payments are not allowed. Unpayable costs cant be paid. Example: You cast Death Bomb, which costs 3B and has an additional cost of sacrificing a creature. You sacrifice Thunderscape Familiar, whose effect makes your black spells cost 1 less to cast. Because a spells total cost is locked in before payments are actually made, you pay 2B, not 3B, even though youre sacrificing the Familiar.
So you can't pay for it. :]
SwiftDeath says... Accepted answer #1
no because the cost of Kuldotha Forgemaster states "tap, sacrifice 3 artifacts:" this being the case you can't sacrifice the 1 wurmcoil and in response sacrifice the 2 tokens they would occur as seperate instances and would result in an illegal action.
you can however sac 3 artifacts 1 being Wurmcoil Engine and search for another artifact (another wurmcoil why not) and still get 2 tokens afterward.
February 1, 2011 11:37 a.m.