how can i lose?
Asked by iamMark 14 years ago
if i have a platinum angel, steel hellkite, and a Indomitable Archangel with whispersilk cloak attached to it is there any way i can lose. i was trying to think of any cards that could kill this combo but i cant think of any off of the top of my head.
are there any cards like that in standard other then day of judgment?
November 27, 2010 6:11 a.m.
Day would be the easiest way, definitely. Or if they Naturalize the Cloak, then kill the Indomitable, your Angel and Hellkite are vulnerable again. Or the opponent can play 3 Gatekeeper of Malakir kicked, if you don't have any other creatures. I don't think Red can answer this situation at all though...
November 27, 2010 6:22 a.m.
gatekeeper of malakir is a great idea. but how would the naturalize work? as long as the angel has metalcraft wouldn't the cloak have shroud. that brings up another question can non creator cards have shroud?
November 27, 2010 6:28 a.m.
Red can answer with Chain Reaction , assuming at least one other creature on the board, preferably two. Dispense Justice and Consuming Vapors are two more non-target removal spells. There are always surprises you can use, such as baiting them to attack with Platinum Angel and then animating Celestial Colonnade to block it (it has happened to me, don't make that mistake). There are always combat tricks you can use to kill attacking creatures, so every game has potential. Never be certain of your combos.
November 27, 2010 6:29 a.m.
Ooh good point, somehow forgot the Cloak was an artifact. My bad. So yeah, non-targeted removal is the only way, really. Board wipe and sacrifice effects. Best answer: don't let that situation come up in the first place =P
November 27, 2010 6:32 a.m.
i agree that you should never be certain of your combos but when i do this i dont attack i just sit there till they mill themselves.
November 27, 2010 6:35 a.m.
Ratchet Bomb can kill absolutely everything that isn't land. Almost any good removal can kill the Archangel, Plummet , Doom Blade burn spells, as long as the Cloak is gone. Naturalize , Oxidda Scrapmelter , Revoke Existence , etc.
Other simpler card answers would include Elspeth Tirel , or possibly Gideon Jura is they have a blocker to kill the Platinum Angel . So basically, white has lots of ways to deal with this and the other colours need a few cards.
November 27, 2010 6:35 a.m.
Nevermind, the Cloak would have shroud. Elspeth still works though, and Gideon Jura and Ratchet Bomb.
November 27, 2010 6:37 a.m.
Jarrod_0067 says... #11
But if you have Darksteel Forge and a Liquimetal Coating out, it becomes a different story altogether :)
The answer? Final Judgment or Contagion Engine
November 27, 2010 7:51 a.m.
Jarrod_0067 says... #12
Best standard removal? Don't let them equip the angel. In response, kill it. Also, they aren't indestructible. Prized Unicorn + Basilisk Collar ftw
November 27, 2010 7:58 a.m.
One word comes screaming to mind... POISON!
Mainly the big boss of poison Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon ... And thats the kicker of all poison kill :)
November 27, 2010 5:55 p.m.
poison wont kill me... as long as i dont block or attack. platinum angel,keeps me from losing the game, that would work if i was using platinum emporion then then i can still lose as long as my life does not change. so as muck as i love skithiryx he would not kill me.
November 27, 2010 6:48 p.m.
Yeah, forgot about Platinum Angel being a pain. Lets see what happens if I mention the following colours as possible addition to black :)
Well, in white, there's Day of Judgment , Elspeth Tirel 's last ability, Glimmerpoint Stag + Revoke Existence . And thats just white...
Green has anything that could get rid of the artifact shrouding your angel... Whats shrouding your cloak though?
For red... the joker card and probably least sure way would be Cerebral Eruption .
Red also has ways to get rid of artifacts - Hoard-Smelter Dragon , Shatter , etc...
Now, regarding blue, and poison... Any blue/black poison deck would be running with bounce spells to win out. Into the Roil or Disperse .
So, just because you have yourself setup, it doesn't mean to say you can be setup forever... To lock a game down, you need to ensure your opponent can't do anything against you... Which means card disruption or control of their plays.
Hope this helps :)
November 27, 2010 7:55 p.m.
Hmm, Re-reading the question there, I think I'm barking up the wrong tree...
Whispersilk Cloak equiping the Indomitable Archangel is indeed a crazy play.
Once this is done, the plays an opponent have against you will be of the nature of forcing you to sacrifice creatures (black has Gatekeeper of Malakir , Consuming Vapors , Anowon, the Ruin Sage , Nemesis Trap , Or Pestilence Demon !) or mass damage (red has Pyromancer Ascension + Pyroclasm , Cerebral Eruption , Chain Reaction Lavaball Trap , Destructive Force , Disaster Radius ), green Used to have Hurricane but I think that in standard at least All Is Dust would still kick ass here. :)
Green and blue would be airing on the side of caution and blowing stuff up before allowing metalcraft to trigger. or at least trying to. :)
November 27, 2010 8:40 p.m.
you are right that there are a good # of cards that could do the job but from what i see most of them are easy to counter, out of standard, or not being used very much where i play. so this combo is not as amazing as i thought but its still pretty good if you ask me.
November 28, 2010 2:03 a.m.
actually, poison could kill you.
Ichor Rats to get you to at least one poison counter.
then heavy use of Contagion Engine , Contagion Clasp and Steady Progress
November 28, 2010 2:35 a.m.
how would the poison kill me? as long as i have platinum angle on the field i cant lose the game so i could be at -100 life, and 50 poison counters and as long as i protect the angle im still good.
November 28, 2010 3:06 a.m.
board wipe, Damnation , Wrath of God , Day of Judgment
Gatekeeper of Malakir , Butcher of Malakir , Anowon, the Ruin Sage , Consuming Vapors to force you to sac your creatures
realistically though, it would take you a while to get those specific cards out, unless you had a lot of land or other mana ramp abilities.
but considering the current meta, you'd probably be milled by jace, the mind sculptor or hit by a hefty amount because of Primeval Titan and Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle already
don't forget about any of the eldrazi's either, like Emrakul, the Aeons Torn . your opponent gives it Sword of Vengeance and you have to sacrifice 12 permanents, six from the first turn, and six from the second turn. plus it has vigilance, so if you do have enough land or whatever to keep your Steel Hellkite , indomitable-angel, Platinum Angel and Whispersilk Cloak , have fun facing a 15/15 flying, first strike, vigilance trample.
instead of finding ways to not lose, find ways to win.
p.s. mark cards with brackets "insert-card-name-here" it makes it easy for EVERYBODY.
November 28, 2010 3:27 a.m.
mistergreen527 says... #21
For extra protection, put another Whispersilk Cloak on a Tajuru Preserver . Might as well activate Elspeth, Knight-Errant 's ultimate while you're at it. Oh, and don't forget that Counterspell on the Isochron Scepter . :D
November 28, 2010 5:15 a.m.
thaimaishuu says... #22
That is ridiculous mistergreen527. Why not get out a Bazaar Trader and give an opponent Abyssal Persecutor and slap Canopy Cover on it for another layer of protection. :]
shamanicgreen says... #1
Something like Damnation would wipe the field of your creatures, since it doesn't target them. Shroud only protects your creatures from effects that specifically target them.
November 27, 2010 6:06 a.m.