how quickly do counters get put on from Test of Faith?
Asked by ilikeoldcardsbetter 14 years ago
lets say you attack with Spined Wurm , I block with Grizzly Bears and play Test of Faith . 3 damage is prevented, but that means 2 damage is still being done to my bears (killing them?).
I'm wondering when the counters get added. I've always figured they'd get added AFTER all the combat stuff has resolved, so in this example it wouldn't help to play Test of Faith , maybe if I had some more mana and Temper ...
The counters get added as the damage is being prevented.
Test of Faith resolves, so the instant effect is on the creature (kind of hidden).
This would be done after the Grizzly Bears is declared as the blocker and the Spined Wurm is already commited to the attack to maximize the chance of the combat damage being done.
So when the damage step happens, the effect kicks in. 3 points of damage is dealt, and as a replacement effect, the instant ability kicks in. Thus for every point of damage, it is prevented and the counter is added. the other 2 points of damage gets dealt as normal and your creature then has 3 toughness left, thus surviving combat, and as a result becomes a bigger creature (5/5).
It works in much the same way as regeneration does. You pay for the effect and an invisible counter is placed to remind you that the creature can survive a round of lethal so it can remain on the battlefield (though tapped).
There is no chance for playing instants in between as this is a static ability that is being created.
Hope this helps
October 3, 2010 1:54 p.m.
ouch, difference of opinion. :)
To clarify my second last sentence.
No chance of playing instants refers to when the combat damage is being dealt.
Oh, and from Gatherer...
01/12/2004 The +1/+1 counters are put onto the creature at the time the damage is prevented. If a 1/1 creature would be dealt 6 damage, 3 damage is prevented and three +1/+1 counters are put onto the creature. The creature is a 4/4 creature with 3 damage on it, so it won't be destroyed because State-Based Actions aren't checked until after Test of Faith is finished resolving.
October 3, 2010 2 p.m.
ilikeoldcardsbetter says... #4
well, unless xeratheenigma has a rebuttal, it looks like I'm gonna have to go with cardcoin. He has backed his opinion with a reference from gatherer, so it looks like he's done his homework.
October 3, 2010 2:14 p.m.
I would actually hold off on this one until we get a few other opinions formed. I played quite a bit during the old Invasion cycle, and as such the rules back then included tricks you could do during combat step.
Now things have changed and as such this could be a little confusing. Best be waiting till we get a few confirmations on this one.
But from researching into this. I'm still correct. The only difference is that your creatures power in the attack is still 2.
You have indeed brought up an interesting question.
October 3, 2010 2:24 p.m.
xeratheenigma says... #6
after seeing cardcoin's response i believe he is correct though your opponent can respond to test of faith with shock, ligthning bolt, or any other form of removal to get rid of your grizzly bears
October 3, 2010 3:01 p.m.
the bears hit 2 because both combat damage are dealt at the same time, before the "prevent and add counters" effect take place.. so the bears hit for 2 and recieve 5 at the same time, then prevent 3 and get 3 counters at the same time.. ends up as a 5/5 with 2 damage...now, i got another question for you.. what if the attacking creature instead of a Spined Wurm was a Dragon Whelp ? how much +1/+0 youd have to add? and would it work to pay for it in response to you opponent casting Test of Faith ?
xeratheenigma says... #1
the grizzly bears would die because the counters are added after damage is dealt so if you had six mana temper would be better for this situation
October 3, 2010 1:54 p.m.